What was worse, materialism was sometimes regarded as synonymous with atheism and in the opinion of many people being an atheist is not a good thing.
To explain science and it meaning by a metaphysics in which there is no room for non physical objects or properties leaves no room for gods and the like. And the Identity Theory tells us that the mind is just a physical thing.
The identity theory gets its name because it identifies, claims an identity, between mental states and certain brain states. I say "certain" brain states,
because whilst the identity theory claims that every mental state is a brain state, it is not committed to the opposite. In fact, it's certainly not the case that every brain state is a mental state.
When J.J.C. Smart (1920 - …) articulated the identity theory he used a couple of analogies to convey his claim that mental states are brain states.
According to him, mental states are brain states in the same way that water is H2O and lightning is an atmospheric electrical discharge.
These analogies point at one specific feature. It took considerable scientific investigation to discover that water is identical to H2O and that lightning is an electric discharge and not a weapon of a god.
Similarly, the claim that mental states are brain states isn't supposed to be an obvious truth which can be established by simple observation or by reflecting on the meanings of expressions like 'belief' and 'cortex'.
Rather,the claim that mental states are brain states is plausible in part because of advances in our understanding of the human brain.
There is an other aspect with regard to identity. To make this clear we need the important type - token distinction.
In my garden I see blackbirds, sparrows and finches. They are all of the same type, that is "bird". The individual birds I call tokens of the type bird.
Now we take this one step further to understand the concept of identity, when we talk about token identity and type identity.
The current president of the US and Obama both can invite me for a party. In this case they are token identical as instantiations of the type "president" for instance.
In contrast,the identities between water and H2O,and between lightning and atmospheric electrical discharge, are type identities.
Every token of the type water is a token of the type H2O, and every token of the type Iightning is a token of the type atmospheric electrical discharge.
Science has discovered that the type water and the type H2O are identical, as are the types Iightning and atmospheric electrical discharge.
Now we may clarify the kind of identity which is meant by the Identity Theory. According to this theory there is a type identity between mental states and brain states.
For example, every token of the type pain is a token of the type c-fiber firing. The c-fiber is especial nerve which when firing gives us the experience of pain.
So, the identity theory asserts that every type of mental state is identical to a type of brain state. The brain states in question are physical states of the brain.
These identities are not supposed to be discoverable by simple observation or by examining the meanings of the terms involved. Rather, they are analogous to scientific identities like " water is H2O".
This may sound all very plausible. But as you may expect, this is a philosophical theory, thence there certainly will be people who disagree with is.
That will be the subject of our next lecture. ㋡
The Discussion
[13:19] herman Bergson: Thank you...
[13:19] Qwark Allen: ::::::::: * E * X * C * E * L * L * E * N * T * ::::::::::
[13:20] Mick Nerido: So for every mind state the is a specific brain state
[13:20] herman Bergson: The floor is yours now ... ㋡
[13:20] Qwark Allen: yes indeed
[13:20] Qwark Allen: mick
[13:20] Lizzy Pleides: great
[13:20] herman Bergson: Yes Mick...that is the idea
[13:21] Gir (florencio.flores): herman but every brain is different and we are all the same thing
[13:21] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): tries every type of mental state etc
[13:21] Gir (florencio.flores): you know the human thing
[13:21] Qwark Allen: you experience pleasure when , endorfines are released in the brain
[13:21] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): hmmm
[13:21] :: Beertje :: (beertje.beaumont): so by changing our mind we can change our brain?
[13:21] Qwark Allen: more the oppposite
[13:21] Qwark Allen: change the brain, and you change the mind
[13:22] herman Bergson: You are changing one and the same thing Beertje
[13:22] Gir (florencio.flores): herman but every brain is different and we are all the same thing
[13:22] herman Bergson: And yes Gir every brain is different.....
[13:22] Gir (florencio.flores): you know the human thing
[13:22] Gir (florencio.flores): yes yes
[13:22] herman Bergson: but we are talking about type identity....
[13:22] Lizzy Pleides: we have all different synapses
[13:23] Gir (florencio.flores): if you think in the future its just all about ID'S
[13:23] herman Bergson: so we both experience pain in our finger...btu that doesnt need to mean that your mental state is exactly identical with mine...
[13:23] Mick Nerido: The point is there is a physical manifesation in the brain for all mental states
[13:23] herman Bergson: the specific experience of for instance pain is a token of the type pain....or call it an instantiation
[13:24] herman Bergson: Yes Mick...and fMRI scanners show more and more that this is the case
[13:24] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): Yes-ah!
[13:24] herman Bergson: the idea is this....
[13:25] Alaya Chépaspourquoi (alaya.kumaki): then that would mean that prisoners have a brain change over the year, after the pain or imprisonment?
[13:25] herman Bergson: science could talk about water......or about H2O....
[13:25] herman Bergson: And science uses H2O ....so reduces water to H2O
[13:26] herman Bergson: something similar you could see with mental states...
[13:26] Gir (florencio.flores): but in Science herman the science got the state of plasma it is similar like the water
[13:26] herman Bergson: we talk about joy and pain....science talks about certain brain activity...
[13:27] Mick Nerido: If I am imagining Niagra Falls would every ones brain look the same doing this?
[13:27] Qwark Allen: heeheh
[13:27] herman Bergson: oops?
[13:27] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): ohoh
[13:27] :: Beertje :: (beertje.beaumont): lol
[13:27] herman Bergson: Qwark fainted?
[13:27] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): word trigger
[13:27] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ LOL ♥
[13:27] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): fall
[13:27] Qwark Allen: was to much for me
[13:27] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): oops
[13:27] Qwark Allen: °͜° l ☺ ☻ ☺ l °͜°
[13:27] Qwark Allen: lol
[13:27] herman Bergson: lol
[13:27] Alaya Chépaspourquoi (alaya.kumaki): if the brain activity is induced by an external factor, than would we talk about, external activity? rather than brain activity, maybe reactivity?
[13:28] herman Bergson: No Alaya....
[13:28] Gir (florencio.flores): profesor?
[13:28] herman Bergson: and no Mick.....
[13:28] herman Bergson: the instantiation of your mental image of the Niagara f*lls
[13:28] herman Bergson: can be different from the one in my mind
[13:29] herman Bergson: Gir?
[13:29] Gir (florencio.flores): but in Science herman the science got the state of plasma it is similar like the water
[13:29] herman Bergson: what do you mean by that, Gir?
[13:29] bergfrau Apfelbaum: it was very interesting! ty herman&class!!
[13:29] bergfrau Apfelbaum:
[13:29] bergfrau Apfelbaum: .,¡i|¹i¡¡i¹|i¡,. .,¡i|¹i¡¡i¹|i¡,.
[13:29] bergfrau Apfelbaum: `'¹li¡|¡|¡il¹'` `'¹li¡|¡|¡il¹'`
[13:29] bergfrau Apfelbaum:
[13:29] bergfrau Apfelbaum: see u!
[13:30] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): Bye, Bye ㋡
[13:30] herman Bergson: smiles at Bergie
[13:30] Lizzy Pleides: TC Bergfrau
[13:30] :: Beertje :: (beertje.beaumont): bye Bergfrau
[13:30] Gir (florencio.flores): yes herman that science could need for some things water
[13:30] Gir (florencio.flores): but it has it own plasma state
[13:30] Alaya Chépaspourquoi (alaya.kumaki): type plasma?
[13:31] Gir (florencio.flores): yes alaya
[13:31] Florencio spanked Qwark's ass ...
[13:31] herman Bergson: The issue here is that the concept of water is so to speak translated into another language...the language of chemistry
[13:31] Mick Nerido: and not just fire earth air and water...
[13:32] herman Bergson: and we have chooses for that language eventually because we can explain more using that language than using terms like 'water' or 'air'
13:32] Lizzy Pleides: if you say H2O to a child it won't understand
[13:32] Alaya Chépaspourquoi (alaya.kumaki): lol
[13:32] herman Bergson: no....neither would a single person from the Middle Ages
[13:32] Alaya Chépaspourquoi (alaya.kumaki): do you want a glass of type h2o
[13:33] Qwark Allen: or from certain parts of Africa or Australia
[13:33] herman Bergson: smiles
[13:33] herman Bergson: yes plz ㋡
[13:34] herman Bergson: As I said.....the discovery of the identity of water and H2O is the result of scientific research....not just an obvious conclusion from observation
[13:34] Gir (florencio.flores): allright
[13:34] herman Bergson: You amy joke about a glass of H2O, but it tells us yet something...
[13:35] cup of water FoolYa Illusions_worn on r hand whispers: Ahhh Water
[13:35] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): :-)
[13:35] herman Bergson: Maybe one day we will revise our language and for example drop the term water and start talking about H2O only...
[13:36] cup of water FoolYa Illusions_worn on r hand whispers: Ahhh Water
[13:36] Mick Nerido: H2O, h2o everywhere and not a drop to drink?
[13:36] herman Bergson: Like we have dropped a lot of words as real descriptions of reality...for example, spell, curse etc...
[13:36] cup of water FoolYa Illusions_worn on r hand whispers: Ahhh Water
[13:36] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ LOL ♥
[13:36] Gir (florencio.flores): you mean that starting to live the era of scientific reality herman?
[13:36] cup of water FoolYa Illusions_worn on r hand whispers: Ahhh Water
[13:36] herman Bergson: We use them now knowing that these words do not describe reality
[13:36] cup of water FoolYa Illusions_worn on r hand whispers: Ahhh Water
[13:37] herman Bergson: We already live in that aera, Gir
[13:37] cup of water FoolYa Illusions_worn on r hand whispers: Ahhh Water
[13:37] herman Bergson: lol....
[13:37] Lizzy Pleides: but we have different kinds of water
[13:37] Gir (florencio.flores): ok
[13:37] herman Bergson: water !!!
[13:37] Gir (florencio.flores): brb
[13:37] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): Yes-ah!
[13:37] Coagulate Script Counter: Your script count went up by 1 to 91 scripts.
[13:37] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): ohoh
[13:38] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): oh dear this class is deteriorating
[13:38] herman Bergson: smiles...
[13:38] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): maybe another analogy would be better at the next class
[13:38] herman Bergson: Time to thank you all for your participation
[13:38] Qwark Allen: fall
[13:38] herman Bergson: Class dismissed... ㋡
[13:38] Qwark Allen: °͜° l ☺ ☻ ☺ l °͜°
[13:38] Qwark Allen: lol
[13:38] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): thnx
[13:39] herman Bergson: oh dear...
[13:39] herman Bergson whispers: what did you put in the water Alaya!!!
[13:39] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): Bye, Bye ㋡
[13:39] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): lol
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