Metaphysical theories do not stand independent of epistemological theories. Epistemology is the branch of philosophy that concerns itself with knowledge and belief.
Anyone asserting an ontological theory needs to have something to say about epistemology. There has to be an answer to questions like....
How do you KNOW that what you say exists does, in fact, exist, or on what grounds do you believe that what you say exists, really exists?
You could say that by nature we want to know. We want to know what caused this or that. We want to know where this or that came from. We want to know what to do next and so on.
This is not just about knowledge. It also has a psychological dimension: not knowing makes us feel anxious and uneasy.
The issue of whether or not a theory is true, whether or not it is genuine knowledge, is most of the time not our primary concern, We just want a peace of mind.
This brings us to the central question of epistemology: what method do we use to achieve real knowledge?
Most societies through history had some theory or story about the origine and nature of the world and natural phenomena.
Such stories play an important role in society. In the first place, when everyone believes the same story it strengthens the social cohesion.
A second property of such stories and theories is, that they very often involve reference to gods and spirits in the accounts given of natural phenomena.
Such stories and theories depict the worldview of a society. The epistemological origine of such a worldview is often hidden.
Most of the time it is based on some kind of authority, be it priests or sacred scripture. You can imagine, as we have mentioned before, that materialists have been in dispute about such worldviews most of the time.
In virtually all instances before the twentieth century, whenever there was a more or less established worldview materialism was in opposition to it.
It is a remarkable fact that materialism almost always has been regarded as something negative and a threat to society.
Now, what may be the possible source of knowledge? As we have seen in many projects, traditionally, in philosophy,
two contrasting answers to this question are empiricism and rationalism. Simply said, empiricism finds the source of all knowledge in our perception of the world through our sense organs.
Rationalism finds the source of knowledge in our reason. However, this not and either - or situation,
True, human beings can not be imagined without sense organs,
we need perception to safely interact with our environment. But as the philosopher Immanuel Kant already noticed,
there can not exist pure sensory input. We have to apply some reason to this stream of data to bring some order in it.
In other words, knowledge can only come from an interplay of reason and perception. It is a balance of power, the materialist has to deal with.
What is the input of reason and what the input of perception that creates real knowledge. Current materialist epistemology has evolved
to coincide with what can be identified as the epistemology of modern science. With this perspective, empirical evidence is a necessary but not a sufficient element for knowledge.
Any assertion about the nature of reality may start from reasoned speculation, but must be subjected to test and critique and therefore, it may face potential rejection.
And theories that cannot be tested rule themselves out from scientific credibility. Maybe someone might want to dispute scientific credibility as a standard of true knowledge.....
Thank you for your attention again....
Main Sources:
MacMillan The Encyclopedia of Philosophy, 2nd edition
TABLE OF CONTENT -----------------------------------------------------------------
1 - 100 Philosophers 9 May 2009 Start of
2 - 25+ Women Philosophers 10 May 2009 this blog
3 - 25 Adventures in Thinking 10 May 2009
4 - Modern Theories of Ethics 29 Oct 2009
5 - The Ideal State 24 Febr 2010 / 234
6 - The Mystery of the Brain 3 Sept 2010 / 266
7 - The Utopia of the Free Market 16 Febr 2012 / 383
8. - The Aftermath of Neo-liberalism 5 Sept 2012 / 413
9. - The Art Not to Be an Egoist 6 Nov 2012 / 426
10 - Non-Western Philosophy 29 May 2013 / 477
11 - Why Science is Right 2 Sept 2014 / 534
12 - A Philosopher looks at Atheism 1 Jan 2015 / 557
13 - EVIL, a philosophical investigation 17 Apr 2015 / 580
14 - Existentialism and Free Will 2 Sept 2015 / 586
15 - Spinoza 2 Sept 2016 / 615
16 - The Meaning of Life 13 Febr 2017 / 637
17 - In Search of my Self 6 Sept 2017 / 670
18 - The 20th Century Revisited 3 Apr 2018 / 706
19 - The Pessimist 11 Jan 2020 / 819
20 - The Optimist 9 Febr 2020 / 824
21 - Awakening from a Neoliberal Dream 8 Oct 2020 / 872
22 - A World Full of Patterns 1 Apr 2021 / 912
23 - The Concept of Freedom 8 Jan 2022 / 965
The Discussion
[13:15] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): Thank you Herman
[13:15] herman Bergson: So you may conclude that the materialist is primarily an empiricist who accepts input from reason as long as it can be tested
[13:16] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): very organized
[13:16] herman Bergson: yes :-)
[13:16] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): I see
[13:16] oola Neruda: scientists are very good at being sure to meet that criteria... take bubble chambers and spark chambers for example
[13:17] herman Bergson: And scientific method is his way of obtaining true knowledge
[13:17] Dien (djdien.bailey) is offline.
[13:17] oola Neruda: yes
[13:17] oola Neruda: evidence
[13:18] herman Bergson: Yes...higgs particles were predicted by reasoning, but never "seen" until they showed up in test results
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): exactly
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and I have seen them live
[13:18] herman Bergson: Same with quantum physics.....
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): many times
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaa yes
[13:18] herman Bergson: Einstein didn't believe in it....but yet it has been proven to be real
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): that is a strange field
[13:19] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): very
[13:19] herman Bergson: it ids indeed Bejiita
[13:19] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): same with relativity, how can time slow down as speed increase until it completley stops at the speed of light
[13:19] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): still this have been confirmed, clocks at high speed go slower then other stationary clocks
[13:19] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): have been tested and confirmed
[13:20] herman Bergson: I have no idea, Bejiita....I am only a simple philosopher ^_^
[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): out in space too
[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): is true
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its one of few physical laws i dont get
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but still its there,
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): a true brain spinner
[13:20] oola Neruda: altitude also affects the clock experiments
[13:20] oola Neruda: strangely enough
[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right
[13:21] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): in LHC u also can see it, if u look at the RF frequency it just ramps up in the beginning and then its more or less constant yet the energy of the beams still increase, they become heavier instead of going faster
[13:21] herman Bergson: What is more important in relation to materialism is, that there don't exist transcendent or non physical entities
[13:22] herman Bergson: That consequence of materialism has made it so unpopular
[13:22] herman Bergson: People love their ghosts, and gods
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I can see why
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed Herman
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i also like ghosts this time of year
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): mr halloween creepy cozy man
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): im in that mood now
[13:23] herman Bergson: Maybe materialism makes people feel uneasy......
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): creepy places Gemma?
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): tnx
[13:24] herman Bergson: Because it doesnt give that many answers
[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): it must have since so many dont like it
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡
[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes bej
[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): lovely tho
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm yes i guess
[13:24] herman Bergson: Man's greatest fear is death, I guess.....
[13:25] herman Bergson: Since we think in terms of time, we have problems with an observation that one's time is up at a given moment :-)
[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): true
[13:25] herman Bergson: We want to live on
[13:25] herman Bergson: want
[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): watching these families who lose people in Ukraine is terrible
[13:26] herman Bergson: So we create stories that ease our mind and fear
[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): a mother who lost an 11 year old child
[13:26] oola Neruda: the days grow short when you meet september
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah
[[13:26] herman Bergson: It is terrible indeed Gemma
[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): over 100 were taken by the storm in Florida
[13:28] herman Bergson: Seems you are a bunch of materialists :-)
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we just may be
[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe
[13:28] herman Bergson: No one wants to dight about religion for instance :-)
[13:28] herman Bergson: fight
[13:29] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): let every one believe what he or she wants to
[13:29] herman Bergson: The next step in materialism is to discuss its relation with atheism and agnosticism
[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): nope we have tried to avoid that in this class for 15 years
[13:30] herman Bergson: From my point of view there is little to avoid Gemma :-)
[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ah but the basic rule of the class was always avoid religious discussion
[13:31] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): as much as possible
[13:31] herman Bergson: The hot issue in relation to that subject is the matter of how do you obtain reliable knowledge
[13:31] herman Bergson: Yes...we don't deal in theology here :-))
[13:32] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): unless we have to
[13:32] oola Neruda: depends on the subject under discussion
[13:32] herman Bergson: indeed
[13:32] oola Neruda: good samaritan.... woman at the well... etc
[13:32] oola Neruda: do unto others as you would have them do unto you
[13:32] herman Bergson: My point has always been that theologists begin with answers, while philosophers begin with questions
[13:32] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i wish cb was still here
[13:33] herman Bergson: Still a riddle why she left SL
[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i know
[13:33] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaaaa yes, I miss CB
[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i spoke to friends of hers who do not know
[13:33] herman Bergson: She is active on a Facebook page
[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): she announced I am going and went
[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah
[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ah give her our regards and say we miss her!!!!!!
[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yes
[13:34] herman Bergson: I'll try
[13:34] bergfrau Apfelbaum: yes!
[13:35] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): she always had good insights from different view
[13:35] herman Bergson: Yes ...and we here seem to agree with each other almost completely today :-)
[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed
[13:36] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i have to go back and read the last week class
[13:36] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i was too busy
[13:36] herman Bergson: A peaceful class :-)
[13:37] herman Bergson: Let me thank you for all this peace :-)
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yw
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡
[13:37] herman Bergson: Class dismissed and go in peace ^_^
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): t
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ Thank Youuuuuuuuuu!! ♥
[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): nice again
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): runs to get back into my ranger outfit
[13:37] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): it's not an easy lecture, that is why we are so quiet I guess
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): and get to work!
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