If there is one thing that makes Marx so important, then it is his unique way of describing historical developments as class struggles.
He was the one who showed us that the basic structure of society is, in fact on the one han,d a small group of rich people owning the means of production
and on the other hand, the masses of workers who are exploited by this small group for personal profit only.
The only solution to this problem was a revolution of the masses. This happened in Russia, including a civil war and happened in China too in the same way.
And here we encounter an interesting situation. Where Russia wasn't that succesful, China succeeded.
When we look at present-day China, a global economic powerhouse combining rapid growth, technological ambition, and tight political control,
we are confronted with an apparent paradox. How did a country that once pursued one of the most radical interpretations of Marxism become a central actor in global capitalism?
When Mao came to power in 1949, following the Chinese Communist Revolution, China was a poor, predominantly agrarian society.
Inspired by the ideas of Karl Marx but adapting them to Chinese conditions, Mao sought not merely to develop the economy but to fundamentally transform society.
Unlike Marx, who saw industrial workers as the revolutionary class, Mao placed his faith in the peasantry. This already marks a significant departure from classical Marxism.
The Chinese Revolution was not the culmination of industrial capitalism’s contradictions, but a response to colonial humiliation, civil war, and rural poverty.
It is too much to go into detail about Chinese history. You all might have heard of the Great Leap Forward (1958–1962) and the Cultural Revolution (1966–1976).
By the time Mao died in 1976, China was politically unified, socially transformed, but economically poor and inefficient.
His successor, Deng Xiaoping, was a pragmatic politician. His famous remark captures it all: “It doesn’t matter whether a cat is black or white, as long as it catches mice.” This was a radical departure from ideological rigidity.
One of Deng’s major reforms was to open China to global trade and investment. Special Economic Zones (SEZs), such as Shenzhen, were created.
Foreign companies were invited. Market pricing was allowed. Export-oriented production flourished. China began integrating into the global capitalist system, while still officially calling itself socialist.
China’s development since Mao is not a simple story of abandoning socialism and embracing capitalism. It is a story of adaptation, experimentation, and synthesis.
Thank you for your attention.. the floor is yours...
Main Sources:
MacMillan The Encyclopedia of Philosophy, 2nd edition
of Economic Thought (2012)
TABLE OF CONTENT -----------------------------------------------------------------
1 - 100 Philosophers 9 May 2009 Start of
2 - 25+ Women Philosophers 10 May 2009 this blog
3 - 25 Adventures in Thinking 10 May 2009
4 - Modern Theories of Ethics 29 Oct 2009
5 - The Ideal State 24 Febr 2010 / 234
6 - The Mystery of the Brain 3 Sept 2010 / 266
7 - The Utopia of the Free Market 16 Febr 2012 / 383
8. - The Aftermath of Neo-liberalism 5 Sept 2012 / 413
9. - The Art Not to Be an Egoist 6 Nov 2012 / 426
10 - Non-Western Philosophy 29 May 2013 / 477
11 - Why Science is Right 2 Sept 2014 / 534
12 - A Philosopher looks at Atheism 1 Jan 2015 / 557
13 - EVIL, a philosophical investigation 17 Apr 2015 / 580
14 - Existentialism and Free Will 2 Sept 2015 / 586
15 - Spinoza 2 Sept 2016 / 615
16 - The Meaning of Life 13 Febr 2017 / 637
17 - In Search of my Self 6 Sept 2017 / 670
18 - The 20th Century Revisited 3 Apr 2018 / 706
19 - The Pessimist 11 Jan 2020 / 819
20 - The Optimist 9 Febr 2020 / 824
21 - Awakening from a Neoliberal Dream 8 Oct 2020 / 872
22 - A World Full of Patterns 1 Apr 2021 / 912
23 - The Concept of Freedom 8 Jan 2022 / 965
24 - Materialism 7 Sept 2022 / 1011
25 - Historical Materialism 5 Oct 2023 / 1088
26 - The Bonobo and the Atheist 9 Jan 2024 / 1102
27 - Artificial Intelligence 9 Feb 2024 / 1108
28 - Why Am I Here 6 Sept 2024 / 1139
The Discussion
[13:18] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): Thank you Herman
[13:19] herman Bergson: When you look around in Shenzhen,, you really get the feeling of being in a modern western capitalist city
[13:19] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): but?
[13:19] herman Bergson: It still is state controled Beertje
[13:20] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes i heard that
[13:20] Max Chatnoir: I've just seen pictures, but that is the look.
[13:20] herman Bergson: That is somewhat the magic of China, a state controlled capitalism
[13:21] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): everything is controlled, people on the streets too
[13:21] herman Bergson: The Chinese big cities look the same as European or American cities today
[13:21] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): except for the thousands of the thousends cameras
[13:21] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its an invisible dystopia
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): people living in a jail and accepting it
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): more or less
[13:22] herman Bergson: To be honest, I don't know... I mean are there also cameras in the fast rural areas?
[13:23] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes everywhere
[13:23] herman Bergson: Or is it just a local city thing?
[13:23] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): in the cities i'm sure ont the land I don't know
[13:25] herman Bergson: It is a one party totalitatian state, so you can expect such control, I guess
[13:25] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes, everything is for the party
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): for good or ba, i recetly saw a vieo on youtube how the state have completley banned porn. Not one single chinese have access to it because of their huge internet firewall allowing only controlled sites
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): good or ba
[13:26] herman Bergson: You don't hear much about dissidents in China...is the people content with their condition humaine?
[13:26] Max Chatnoir: Controlled capitalism means don't get out of line?
[13:27] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): maybe they are not allowed to complain
[13:27] herman Bergson: More or less, yes...if you do you get in trouble...There was that CEO who disappeared for years for instance
[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): no they they are issapeare/murdere
[13:27] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes it was Jack Ma
[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): fall out of the line an u are gone
[13:28] herman Bergson: ahh yes Beertje
[13:28] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): he earned more money than the party, so he has to disappear
[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): to be able to o that with over 1 billion people - total control
[13:29] herman Bergson: But if we focus on the core question of this project, why capitalism, we see something interesting in Chinese economics...
[13:29] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): he was send to a "heropvoedingskamp) don't know the english word for it
[13:29] herman Bergson: They have at least to some extent adopted capitalist princinples of private property
[13:30] herman Bergson: re-education camp?
[13:30] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): sort of yes
[13:30] Max Chatnoir: Private property for everyone?
[13:30] herman Bergson: For a lot of people Max...
[13:31] herman Bergson: for instance...farmers can not own the land, but the surplus value of their production they may keep now
[13:31] bergfrau Apfelbaum: they have a low crime rate
[13:31] herman Bergson: In other words...they can make a profit
[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): oki
[13:33] herman Bergson: In the special Economic zones you can own a private business
[13:33] herman Bergson: Start your own company
[13:33] herman Bergson: But Big Brother State is still watching you
[13:34] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): i don't know if I could be happy in such a state
[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah
[13:34] herman Bergson: I wonder too, Beertje
[13:35] herman Bergson: But you know how it is...if they don't bother me, I won't bother them and we live a happy life
[13:35] bergfrau Apfelbaum: The thought of it is horrible.... but maybe one gets used to it?
[13:35] Max Chatnoir: Sounds a little stressful.
[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed, feeling that you are not human but just a pawn to serve the state and if you do the smallest wrong you are gone
[13:36] herman Bergson: I don't know...is the general feeling among Chinese that they constantly have to look over their shoulder?
[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): that u are more or less just a slave
[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): without value
[13:37] herman Bergson: A thought crossed my mind today....
[13:37] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes Herman, if someone fallon thestreet, for instance and you help him..he could say you pushed him...than you pay all the bills of the hospital
[13:38] herman Bergson: Just keep in mind that Russia nor China ever experienced or practiced democracy...
[13:38] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): that's why nobody is helping a person
[13:38] herman Bergson: like we for instance here in the Netherlands
[13:38] bergfrau Apfelbaum: paranoia is not considered a disease there
[13:38] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed Beertje i heard that too before
[13:38] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): everyone is an enemy because they are afraid of the state/big brother
[13:39] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): more or less
[13:39] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes Bejiita'
[13:39] Max Chatnoir: I don't like it as a model
[13:39] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and over 1 billion people livinng like that
[13:39] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): horrifying
[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): sad
[13:40] herman Bergson: Well, we can speculate a lot about China...what concerns us here is how it integrates capitalism in a socialist system
[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): well they have managed to do that for sure
[13:40] herman Bergson: And my impression is that they do it quite well
[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and Shenzed is a good example, where all of our gadgets are made
[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): Shenzen
[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): phones, 3 printers an such
[13:41] herman Bergson: Indeed Bejiita ㋡
[13:41] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): i guess money is also very important for them
[13:43] Max Chatnoir: How is "socialism" defined in this system?
[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and sure i have bought some things made there for sure including both phones and also my 3D printer, should i feel bad about that, that im like using people - supporting modern slavery? That is a question i have now and then
[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): the complaints themselves seem serious however like Creality
[13:44] herman Bergson: I really don't know..but free education, free healthcare, no exploitation of workers and all under control of the Party
[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah
[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i hav no idea how it works in detail
[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): as said, i hope just that im not like using people to get my things
[13:46] herman Bergson: Ask AI.... Are the Chinese happy with their life? ㋡
[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i guess i could
[13:47] Max Chatnoir: How could they find out? If the Chinese working class is happy?
[13:47] herman Bergson: As of April 2026, the picture is one of contrast: high levels of national pride and long-term improvements in living standards are currently clashing with significant economic "growing pains" and a shifting social mood.
[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): at least Kudos to the ones at Creality that made my machine, its still going strong and with precision. Sure i dont mass prodice stuff but my littlle mini factory surely does what i want
[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡
[13:48] herman Bergson: While China's score is slightly above the global average (5.57), it remains significantly lower than many Western nations and its neighbor Taiwan (ranked 26th).
[13:48] herman Bergson: China ranks 65th
[13:49] Max Chatnoir: Oh, my, where do we rank?
[13:49] herman Bergson: The successful eradication of absolute poverty remains a major source of life satisfaction for older generations who remember leaner times.
[13:50] Max Chatnoir: That is probably true.
[13:50] herman Bergson: I know that the Fins rank 1st place
[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah
[13:52] herman Bergson: The Netherlands is 5th ㋡
[13:52] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yay
[13:53] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): nice
[13:53] herman Bergson: USA is ranked 24th
[13:53] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): is that still true?
[13:53] herman Bergson: yes, score 2025
[13:53] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): ok
[13:54] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): well
[13:54] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): even with a president with an IQ of room temperature?
[13:54] herman Bergson: I am glad to see we are all happy, so time to move on
[13:55] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): an now he threatens nuking Iran
[13:55] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): "an entire generation will die tonight!"
[13:55] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): he said on TS
[13:55] herman Bergson: Not the subject of today, so thank you all again for yoyr participation... ㋡
[13:55] herman Bergson: Class dismissed...
[13:55] Max Chatnoir: Yes, let's not go there...
[13:55] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): well i hope he wont but many are horrified now
[13:56] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): thank yu Hermman
[13:56] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): well was a good class againn
[13:56] herman Bergson: Indeed Max....
[13:56] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): interesting
[13:56] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): ow my typos is excelent tonight
[13:56] Max Chatnoir: Thanks, Herman.
[13:56] Max Chatnoir: Kind of a sobering picture!
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