713: Revolutionary Developments.....

The period around 1900 showed a rapid development in science.

   

Sigmund Freud introduced his psychology. Arthur Evans discovered the pre-hellenistic roots of our civilization.

   

Hugo de Vries  stood at the cradle of what we now call genetics and rediscovered Mendel's laws of heredity.

   

Also in physics happened a lot in a short period. The ancient Greeks already had suggested that matter was composed of small particles.

    

At the beginning of the 18th century Isaac Newton thought, that atoms were invisible and indivisible small billiard ball like particles.

    

But what about the empty "space" between these tiny balls? If matter were composed of atoms, what were atoms composed of? 

  

Were they the smallest particles, or was there something smaller? In the late 1800s, a number of scientists, interested in questions like these,

   

investigated the electrical discharges that could be produced in low-pressure gases, with the most significant discovery made by English physicist J. J. Thomson (1856 - 1940)  using a cathode ray tube. 

   

This apparatus consisted of a sealed glass tube from which almost all the air had been removed; the tube contained two metal electrodes.  

  

When high voltage was applied across the electrodes, a visible beam called a cathode ray appeared between them. 

  

This beam was deflected toward the positive charge and away from the negative charge, and interacted with magnetism. You could deflect the beam with a magnet.

In similar experiments, the ray was simultaneously deflected by an applied magnetic field, and measurements of the extent of deflection 

  

and the magnetic field strength allowed Thomson to calculate the charge-to-mass ratio of the cathode ray particles. 

  

The results of these measurements indicated that these particles were much lighter than atoms. Thus the electron was discovered and the basics for making a television.

  

Television became available in crude experimental forms in the late 1920s, but it would still be several years before the new technology would be marketed to consumers. 

  

After World War II, an improved form of black-and-white TV broadcasting became popular in the United States and Britain, 

  

and television sets became commonplace in homes, businesses, and institutions. During the 1950s, television was the primary medium for influencing public opinion.

  

Just imagine how the scientific developments in the 20th century have shaped our world of today. We can no longer imagine a world without television.

    

More dangerous in this search for the smallest particles was, that it eventually also ended in creating the atom bomb.

But how we see the world was not only revolutionized  by science. Also fine art contributed to the revolution.

   

On October 25, 1900, the train from Barcelona arrived in Paris at the Gare d'Orsay. One of its passengers was Pablo Picasso (1881 - 1973). He was then only 19 years old.

Picasso was in Paris because of the Exposition Universelle. In the Spanish pavilion was his painting "Last Moments" exhibited.

   

What maybe not everyone knows, Picasso was at that age a very promising and talented, but still traditional, figurative painter.

    

His cubism only emerged in 1907 with his painting "Les Demoiselles d'Avignon " which introduced a whole new approach to art, its function and meaning.

    

In other words, already from the very beginning of the 20th century science and art caused, that the world from then on never would be the same anymore.

   

Thank you for your attention again.....

    

The Discussion

[13:21] Ciska Riverstone: thanx herman

[13:21] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:21] Aph (aphrodite.macbain): thank you

[13:22] herman Bergson: Again we see that evolution needed millions of years to change our being in this world, while the 20th century needed only periods of decennia to do the same

[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah

[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed we take many things fro granted nowadays without giving them a 2nd thought

[13:23] herman Bergson: We are exposed to changes these days at high speed.....

[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): like the tv

[13:23] herman Bergson: indeed Bejiita....

[13:24] Aph (aphrodite.macbain): and SL!

[13:24] herman Bergson: Although the effect on our existence is enormous

[13:24] herman Bergson: Indeed Aph....and the Internet in general

[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and speaking of atoms, the CRt also gave birth to the particle accelerator, an old tv tube and the LHC basically operate on the same basic principle

[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): allowing us to further study the atoms and similar

[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): while we watch more and more crap on the tv

[13:25] herman Bergson: And we have found a lot of new particles indeed....I knew you would love this Bejiita ^_^

[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe

[13:25] Aph (aphrodite.macbain): I was thinking about the influence of Darwin and his natural selection

[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): we have for sure

[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): also the www was created by a guy at CERN

[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): the link system with browsers and similar

[13:26] herman Bergson: The most interesting observation could be that homo sapiens seems to be capable of keeping u with these rapid changes in his environment

[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its a CERN creation

[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): otherwise we would probably still use some BBS like system

[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm indeed, and toddlers today take IPads as granted as wooden toys

[13:27] herman Bergson: It is amazing to see how easy we take things for granted

[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): because they have "always" been around us

[13:28] druth Vlodovic: I find it odd that proto humans needed 200,000 years to figure out tying rocks to sticks, now we are shuttling through changes like mad

[13:28] herman Bergson: yes we grew up in this world Bejiita

[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): while elon musk sends electric cars into space

[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): lol

[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): electric

[13:28] herman Bergson: YEs Druth

[13:28] druth Vlodovic: I wonder what would happen if an animal managed to hit the right cognitive method of inventing and adapting technologies

[13:29] Aph (aphrodite.macbain): I am afraid I must go. Thank you!

[13:29] herman Bergson: That is what I was wonder just now....

[13:29] druth Vlodovic: ttfn aph

[13:29] herman Bergson: Has evolution come to an end?

[13:30] John Howard Cassio (sticaatsi): Ciao Aph

[13:30] herman Bergson: or are we just some little aberration of evolution, which makes us what we are compared to the animal kindom?

[13:30] herman Bergson: kingdom

[13:30] druth Vlodovic: I think it was "childhood's end" where humans reverted to a primitive state after achieving spaceflight, intelligence was just a reaction to overcrowding like locusts

[13:31] bergfrau Apfelbaum: the evolution never ends, our grandchildren have big plans :-)

[13:32] herman Bergson: But intelligence appeared long before the world was overcrowded

[13:32] herman Bergson: Humanity could change due to genetic engineering....

[13:33] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah

[13:34] herman Bergson: But we won't witness that in our lifetime, I assume

[13:34] bergfrau Apfelbaum: hmm yes

[13:35] herman Bergson: Will the future be that we help evolution a little bit?

[13:35] herman Bergson: But in what direction?

[13:35] Ciska Riverstone: the chip underneath the skin could become true for  some of us here

[13:36] herman Bergson: That is possible indeed Cisca

[13:36] herman Bergson: It already exists....

[13:36] Ciska Riverstone: yes

[13:36] Ciska Riverstone: so maybe we all get chipped at one point

[13:36] herman Bergson: Like electronic brain stimulation for epileptic patients

[13:36] Ciska Riverstone: yes

[13:36] druth Vlodovic: there is a youtuber who inserted a bit of magnet under his skin (turned out to be a bad idea) so he would be able to sense magnetic fields

[13:37] Ciska Riverstone: or direct access to wikipedia ;)

[13:37] druth Vlodovic: imagine the popup ads

[13:37] Ciska Riverstone: lol yes

[13:37] herman Bergson: and the viruses...!

[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako) whispers: OOOW

[13:37] Ciska Riverstone: totally

[13:37] herman Bergson: We could be hacked!

[13:37] John Howard Cassio (sticaatsi): Maybe tatuated chips

[13:38] druth Vlodovic: you see if Picard had helped the Borg install Facebook...

[13:38] John Howard Cassio (sticaatsi): chips so tiny to be tatuated

[13:38] John Howard Cassio (sticaatsi): chips that use nanotechnologies

[13:38] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah

[13:38] herman Bergson: It is probably all in the pipeline....

[13:39] Ciska Riverstone whispers: and a voice in your head that often repeats "don't eat cookies"

[13:39] druth Vlodovic: I heard a lecture that called humans natural cyborgs since the first thing we do is enhance our natural abilities with tools

[13:39] herman Bergson: But again.....what you see is that we only needed one century to achieve all this

[13:40] herman Bergson: Well, Druth, there are a number of animals that use tools too

[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): apes do that

[13:40] herman Bergson: homo sapiens is not unique in using tools

[13:40] herman Bergson: even some birds

[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yes

[13:41] druth Vlodovic: so what was the tipping point?   using tools to make tools?   or having an ideology of discovering?   or of sharing knowledge?

[13:41] herman Bergson: What I also find most interesting is how art completely has changed....

[13:42] herman Bergson: I guess one of the first things, Druth, was our consciousness of time....

[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): however we are the only ones using machine tools

[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): however they are also older then o thought

[13:42] herman Bergson: The knowledge that we will be here tomorrow too

[13:43] herman Bergson: which forces us to plan ahead

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): the lathe was the first and the principle is several 1000 years ol

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): old

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): when they figured out that you could spin and object and then shape it with cutting tools

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): the only difference to the machine i use at work is the gearbox and 3 phase electric drive

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but the base principle is same

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): drills have been used for as long too i think

[13:45] herman Bergson: Animals life by the seasons....we can transcend the cycle of seasons....

[13:45] druth Vlodovic: awareness of the future

[13:46] herman Bergson: yes.....so we have to plan ahead.....

[13:46] druth Vlodovic: Dr Peterson sees this as the meaning behind the 1st book of Genesis

[13:46] druth Vlodovic: and sacrifice (we sacrifice our fun now for stability later etc)

[13:47] herman Bergson: Well...being kicked out of that nice park forced us to prepare for our future indeed :-)

[13:48] druth Vlodovic: he sees it as being kicked out of our minds,

[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i build parks so not an issue

[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): my company have contributed to many nice relax areas in my city

[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:48] druth Vlodovic: the scary outside world is about awareness rather than anything else (he has odd opinions on the capability of animals but that is another story)

[13:49] herman Bergson: Who is this Dr. Peterson?

[13:49] druth Vlodovic: Jordan Peterson is a psychology professor and amateur theologist from Canada, he has a youtube channel

[13:50] Ciska Riverstone: I linked him to you at one point herman

[13:50] herman Bergson: Ahh...the Canadian fellow

[13:50] druth Vlodovic: University of Toronto, also considered a controversial figure,

[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok

[13:51] herman Bergson: I think I remember....I saw some documentary about him.....the conflict with his parents .....wasn't it?

[13:51] Ciska Riverstone: well the manosphere kind of hopes he will save masculinity ;)

[13:52] druth Vlodovic: as for art changing at the same time, if darwinism is about adapting to the environment, and technology is about adapting the environment to us then a feedback loop would be inevitable

[13:52] herman Bergson: Could be  true

[13:53] druth Vlodovic: he came out against adding gender expression to Canada's hate laws

[13:53] herman Bergson: ANother chapter....but we have questions about the function of art...how it works and reacts

[13:53] druth Vlodovic: it set off the SJWs, but since then he has become a sort of new DR.Phil/ Ann Landers to many

[13:54] herman Bergson: In other words a kind of odd character?

[13:54] druth Vlodovic: eh, you'd have to look and make up your own mind

[13:55] herman Bergson smiles

[13:55] herman Bergson: ok

[13:56] herman Bergson: Unless you have another question or remark, I think I gonna work  on making up my own mind about Dr. Peterson.....:-)

[13:56] druth Vlodovic: have fun

[13:56] herman Bergson: So, I thank you all for your participation again.....

[13:56] druth Vlodovic: make sure you look up his own channel though, there is a lot of weird stuff out there

[13:56] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): thank you Herman

[13:56] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok

[13:56] herman Bergson: I will Druth

712: Now we can help evolution...

On March 25, 1900, in the same week that Arthur Evans made his first historical discovery,

  

the Dutch botanist Hugo de Vries (1848 - 1935) solved an extremely important piece of the evolutionary puzzle. 

   

That day he held a lecture for the German Botanical Association in Mannheim. 

   

De Vries had experimented since 1889 with the cultivation and crossing of plants, such as asters, chrysanthemums and violets. 

  

On the basis of these experiments, he told his audience, he had concluded that the features of a plant, the hereditary material, was made up of certain units. 

  

In other words, every property, such as the length of the stamens or the color of the leaves, corresponds to a "specific material carrier". 

  

Even though his concepts were primitive and he was still searching, that evening in Mannheim De Vries talked about what later  would be called the genes. 

   

In the first place, he noted that certain characteristics of flowers, such as the color of the leaves, 

  

always concerned one or the other, and never anything in between. For example, after crossing, they were white or red and never pink.

    

From that moment on there was almost an avalanche of new discoveries in genetics, from genes to DNA in the 20th century.

  

The first meaning of de Vries' his discovery was the confirmation and scientific substantiation of Darwin's evolution theory.

    

The 20th century thus meant a total revolution in how we look at ourselves. In stead of creatures of a god, we became  a part of the animal kingdom.

   

After 2000 year of christianity this new view on man became a threat for the dominance of the church.

   

When you now look at the landscape, you can see for yourself what the results are of what happened in the previous century.

    

But from a philosophical point of view this development in the 20th century also has brought us a huge ethical issue: eugenics

   

Eugenics is the philosophy and social movement that argues it is possible to improve the human race 

  

and society by encouraging reproduction by people or populations with “desirable” traits, termed “positive” eugenics 

  

and discouraging reproduction by people with “undesirable” qualities, termed “negative” eugenics. 

  

The eugenics movement began in the United States in the early part of the 20th century. 

  

The United States was the first country to have a systematic program for performing sterilizations on individuals without their knowledge or against their will.

      

During the 20th century, a total of 33 states had sterilization programs in place. It is thought that around 65,000 Americans were sterilized during this time period.

   

The eugenics movement in the U.S. slowly lost favor over time and was waning by the start of World War II. 

   

When the horrors of Nazi Germany became apparent, as well as Hitler’s use of eugenic principles to justify the atrocities, 

  

eugenics lost all credibility as a field of study or even an ideal that should be pursued.

The most significant difference between modern genetic technologies, that some view as eugenic, and the historical use of eugenics is consent.  

  

Today, individuals pursue genetic testing by choice.  An individual can never be forced into testing or be required to take action, 

  

such as sterilization, based on the results of a genetic test.  

  

Individuals differ in their views on genetic testing in relation to reproductive decision-making and possible eugenic motivations, 

  

but at least today parents have the choice to use the technology or not.

   

Nevertheless, where evolution needed millions of years to make man, the (re)making of man is now at our fingertips with genetic manipulation.

   

Just think of embryo screening today. As science advances, what traits might people be able to choose or select against, to ask just one question.

  

Is it acceptable for society to dictate genetic decisions to prospective parents? This is the ethical legacy of the 20th century.

   

Thank you for your attention again....^_^

The Discussion

[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): It will be interesting to see where this goes....

[13:18] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): can be dangerous like in WO 2

[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): several centuries ago could not even operate on a body

[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes

[13:18] herman Bergson: that is a gentle description of a perspective Gemma

[13:19] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): well there are times when they will be able to manipulate a fetus to prevent something like ALS

[13:19] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): does it lead to people who are all the same?

[13:19] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): or worse

[13:19] herman Bergson: We are able to remove the down syndrom from this earth for instance

[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): and prevent abortion

[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right

[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but looking for the perfect offspring just to be wonderful parents

[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): not so good

[13:20] herman Bergson: what is the perfect man?

[13:21] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): mine :)

[13:21] herman Bergson: who defines that?

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that is what the parents might like to decide

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): their view of perfect

[13:21] herman Bergson: ok Beertje lol :-)

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): beertje

[13:21] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): what is perfection?

[13:21] CB Axel: That's why I don't think we'd all end up being the same. Different parents would like different traits.

[13:21] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): your view of

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right cb

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but is that ethical

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ?

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): preventing a terrible disease i say is yes

[13:22] herman Bergson: THAT is the big question....

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right

[13:22] CB Axel: I think it takes the fun out of seeing what you get. °͜°

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): will be a while before w know

[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): if a child can be spared from a life nthreatening disease or something similar its a good thing

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes

[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its about how it is used i guess

[13:22] herman Bergson: and then we first have to deal with the question what we mean by ethical

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): very true

[13:23] herman Bergson: not so easy anymore these days either

[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ethical = not used for evil or bad things

[13:23] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but was not easy 4 centuries ago either

[13:23] herman Bergson: no Bejiita....that doesnt work....

[13:23] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): stealing bodies to learn

[13:23] herman Bergson: because the concepts EVIL and BAD are already ethical concepts

[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): took a while for science to be undertood for medical purposes

[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and we dont want either evil or bad things

[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): we want good things that benefits us all

[13:24] herman Bergson: sorry BEjiita....

[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): there are still people who wont takd a sick child to the hospital but rely on prayer

[13:25] CB Axel: There are those who think when a person is born with a genetic mutation, even one that causes suffering, it is still their god's plan and think that aborting that fetus is evil.

[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i guess its more complex than that thogh

[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes cb

[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we are still arguing about the same issues

[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ohoh there goes bergie

[13:26] CB Axel: Those same people, when ill, will still go to a doctor. Isn't their illness part of their god's plan. I say let them suffer.

[13:26] herman Bergson: Welll...yes CB...we also have to face religious ideas which ignore scientific insights

[13:27] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): i think they can manipulate genes now to heal diseases

[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): not yet  i think is it allowed

[13:27] herman Bergson: Yes Beertje they can....

[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yes, if you do the right things you can probably do that

[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): the DNA is basically the programming language of life

[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i think stilll researching

[13:27] herman Bergson: that is...they can prevent someone to be bornwith a down syndrome for instance....

[13:27] herman Bergson: thus removing the gene from the hereditary line

[13:27] CB Axel: I don't mind them ignoring scientific insights nearly as much as I mind them ignoring their contradictions.

[13:28] CB Axel: Pick a side, religious zealots! Your god's plan or science improving your life.

[13:29] herman Bergson smiles

[13:29] herman Bergson: Yes CB....that is the whole point :-)

[13:29] herman Bergson: jBut humans are weird beings......

[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): or creating those who do this kind of research and advise

[13:30] herman Bergson: always the fundamental debate about the difference between knowledge and belief

[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): basic!!

[13:30] herman Bergson: very...Gemma

[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): still dont get that there are so many today who ignore facts and believe in religious magic and hokus pokus

[13:30] CB Axel: It's not just that debate. It's their inconsistent usage of their beliefs.

[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i say PROVE that god exist and i will believe, cause then it is a fact

[13:31] CB Axel: wb, Bergie.

[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): wb bergie

[13:31] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): *~*☟☹☟*~* Hey, Welcome back! *~*☟☹☟*~*

[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:31] herman Bergson: bejiita.....which god....

[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): thats the other thing, everyone thinks just one god exist still there are millions of proposed ones

[13:32] Ciska Riverstone: hahaha

[13:32] bergfrau Apfelbaum: tyy ... i had a bluescreen

[13:32] herman Bergson: I have a list of more than 3000 gods who were worshipped in the past 2500 years

[13:32] Ciska Riverstone: bergi

[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): making it even mor unlogical tat a god will exist

[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its just a mindghost

[13:32] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): must be crouwded in heaven Bejiita:)

[13:32] herman Bergson: oh that it is....

[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): agree

[[13:33] herman Bergson: but...just keep in mind.....

[13:33] herman Bergson: a lot of things we do is based on believe.....not on knowledge....

[13:33] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): thats true

[13:33] herman Bergson: we assume there is knowledge behind it....

[13:34] herman Bergson: for instance...

[13:34] herman Bergson: the doctor says you have xxx Y xxx...here is a pill

[13:34] herman Bergson: You say THANK YOU...

[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we do ti all the time!!

[13:34] herman Bergson: totally nuts if you say...I only accept what I KNOW

[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:34] herman Bergson: You  BELIEVE in such a situation

[13:35] CB Axel: I don't. LOL I ask for studies that show the pill works.

[13:35] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): at least that its not just a placebo

[13:35] herman Bergson: ok CB....And you died during your study of the literature :-))

[13:35] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yep

[13:35] CB Axel: Good. Then I don't have to listen to people telling what to believe any more. °͜°

[13:36] herman Bergson: The pill would have saved you...but you lacked the faith :-)))

[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe

[13:36] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): is living saving someone?

[13:36] Guestboook van tipjar stand: Gemma Cleanslate donated L$50. Thank you very much, it is much appreciated!

[13:36] CB Axel: Not caring whether I live or die has freed me from all of that.

[13:36] herman Bergson: You do it all day CB....

[13:37] herman Bergson: You goto the store...the sales person says...yes...really is good stuff...works...and you buy it :-)

[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we are all dying

[13:37] herman Bergson: Oh yes Gemma....

[13:37] herman Bergson: the longer you live the sooner you will die :-))

[13:37] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): lol

[13:38] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): just not knowing when or how

[13:38] herman Bergson: But getting back to our main issue of Tuesday....

[13:38] CB Axel: What am I buying? Clothes that cover my body and keep me warm? Meat, fruits, and vegetables that fill my stomach?

[13:38] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): you just die from living, some short some long

[13:38] herman Bergson: We can MAKE man today....

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): what was the original issue

[13:39] CB Axel: Good question, Gemma. °͜°

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): thought it was the effect of eugenics on philosophy

[13:39] herman Bergson: Genetic manipulation is possible....

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes

[13:39] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): can we manipulate ur genens to live forever?

[13:40] herman Bergson: and we face serious ethical questions here

[13:40] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): who wil pay for us!!!!

[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): as long we are able to work (I really like my work so)

[13:40] herman Bergson: only the living ask to live forever.....

[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): not at 150!!

[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): bejita

[13:41] herman Bergson: how dumb can they be :-)

[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but i say in theory it would be possible, as i said, DNA is the programming language of life

[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i dont think i want to

[13:41] CB Axel: If genetic manipulation can make us live longer it should be able to make us live healthier, too, so working at age 150 would be possible.

[13:41] herman Bergson: ON this subject read Simone de Beauvoir....

[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed

[13:42] CB Axel: The one's paying then are the young people who are waiting for us to die so they can get our jobs.

[13:42] herman Bergson: Don't know the English title...

[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we wont know what to do with all the information in our brains!!

[13:42] herman Bergson: must be....All men are moral

[13:42] herman Bergson: or Nobody is immortal

[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i liked her

[13:43] CB Axel: I already store information on my phone and computer.

[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:43] CB Axel: My brain is full. I can't learn any more. °͜°

[13:43] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): but Simone didn't know at that time that it was possible to manipulate the genes

[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): it will all be a story at age 150 cb

[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): you don't have to know everything CB

[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): or to remember everything

[13:44] CB Axel: I know, Beertje. That's what Google is for.

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:44] herman Bergson: I even use bookshelves CB :-)

[13:44] CB Axel: How retro!

[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): by the time you are 150 Google is dead

[13:44] herman Bergson: :-)))

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): it will be all stored in a chip buried in our thumb anyway

[13:45] CB Axel: LOL

[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe

[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): maybe

[13:45] CB Axel: I was just going to say that, Gemma.

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ha

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): things to think about!

[13:45] herman Bergson: Ok...before we all die....thank you again for your participation ^_^

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ Thank Youuuuuuuuuu!! ♥

[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): well cu next time

[13:46] herman Bergson: Class dismissed....

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:46] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): i believe it's time to go to sleep

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): sleep well

[13:46] CB Axel: That was fun.

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): if you can

[13:46] herman Bergson: Sweet dreams

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): cu all

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): bye for ow

[13:46] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): welterusten allemaal