318: The Brain, Surprise and already a little Disgust

Behind me you see the facial expression, which is, I guess, familiar to you. Eyes wide open, eyebrows up. In other words complete surprise about what he sees.

This time we are dealing with a simple and pleasant basic emotion: an orchestra conductor, which steers all our actions into one direction:

we need here and now immediate information about our environment, because we are confronted with something unfamiliar and odd. So, eyes wide open and trying to get a good look at it.

We are surprised about something. An emotion, which is hard to study in an experimental laboratory environment and too innocent as an emotion to spend much research effort on.

Yet it is an emotion, which is innate. Babies already are able to be surprised about what they see.

From a philosophical point of view the emotion is also interesting, because all philosophical questions originate from marvel: huh… how can that be? Where does that come from? What is real? And so on.

Often our surprise is accompanied by physiological reactions like taking a deep breath, feeling a shiver. This has lead to the presumption, that there is only a thin line between surprise and fear.

It is indeed a fact, that when the surprising element looks threatening and therefor dangerous, our surprise changes into fear in a split second. A chain of reactions gratefully exploited by horror movies.

But in general surprise is a positive emotion. We love presents. We love new things and above all we are so curious.

From an evolutionary point of view it is understandable, that such a quality, to feel pleased when confronted with new things, is a nice drive to be a curious and exploring individual.

However, it not always gives us a positive feeling. There is that relation between surprise and disbelief: you open the envelope and read the invoice for repairs on your car (What ???!!!!) , or your doctor tells you, that you have only three months to live (No !!!!???).

A simple emotion, but in general focused on getting new information about the subject we are surprised about.

A completely opposite emotion, which stimulates us to get as far away as possible from what we see or smell is disgust.

This , however, is a rather peculiar basic emotion. People all over the world can have this emotion, but as far as we know, you only find this emotion in the repertoire of the homo sapiens.

This could mean that evolutionary this is a rather "young" emotion. Besides that, this emotion is loaded with cultural influences, which makes it hard to identify its function in evolution.

In The Expression of the Emotions in Man and Animals, Charles Darwin wrote that disgust refers to something revolting.

Disgust is experienced primarily in relation to the sense of taste (either perceived or imagined), and secondarily to anything which causes a similar feeling by sense of smell, touch, or vision.

Paul Ekman (born February 15, 1934) is a psychologist who has been a pioneer in the study of emotions and their relation to facial expressions. ("Emotions in the Human Face", 1982).

He showed that contrary to the belief of some anthropologists including Margaret Mead, facial expressions of emotion are not culturally determined, but universal across human cultures and thus biological in origin.

Expressions he found to be universal included those indicating anger, disgust, fear, joy, sadness, and surprise. And these are the basic emotions we are discussing here, because they are all generated by the brain.

Be prepared for the next lecture, because it will be a disgusting one.



The Discussion

[13:20] herman Bergson: Thank you... :-)
[13:20] Rentboy Benoir: thank you
[13:20] herman Bergson: You had some remarks....I noticed...
[13:21] herman Bergson: curiosity...innate or learned....
[13:21] Rentboy Benoir: so disgust is a conditioned response?
[13:21] Clerisse Beeswing: learned response
[13:21] Athena John: I don't think so. It too is innate. We re repulsed by that which we find, well repulsive
[13:21] herman Bergson: It would be if it were only learned behavior....
[13:21] Rentboy Benoir: hmmmm
[13:22] Rentboy Benoir: the reason i ask is because as i grow older the less things i find disgusting
[13:22] Athena John: I would say SOME of it is. We LEARN to be disgusted by certain crimes for example
[13:22] herman Bergson: Well next lecture we'll go into detail, but disgust is partly an innate behavior
[13:22] Mick Nerido: I thought the link between surpise and fear is, well, surpising
[13:23] Rentboy Benoir: i think that might have to do with our basal instincts
[13:23] herman Bergson: Well it was Ekman who pointed at the possible relation Mick
[13:23] Rentboy Benoir: l fight in this case
[13:24] Rentboy Benoir: if a large predator stalking you jumps out, !) you're surprised 2) fear 3)run!!!!
[13:24] Mick Nerido: The facial expression is close
[13:24] herman Bergson: Bodily reactions look a little similar when you see something new...nice or threatening...
[13:24] herman Bergson: yes..you open your eyes wide for instance...
[13:25] Athena John: But Rentboy, in your example, the fear can be trained to be repressed or channeled.
[13:25] herman Bergson: yes Rentboy...something like that....
[13:25] Athena John: Soldiers are trained to repress fear
[13:25] Mick Nerido: Horror movies let us experience fear in a safe place
[13:25] herman Bergson: and if I am not mistaken there are also predators that surprise their victims by special behavior or colors to fool them
[13:26] Rentboy Benoir: i agree, but i was talking about something left over from our basal instincts when we were not as evolved yet
[13:26] Rentboy Benoir: the reaction
[13:26] Rentboy Benoir: the expression
[13:26] Rentboy Benoir: its prolly because of that
[13:26] Rentboy Benoir: you open your eyes to get a better look
[13:26] herman Bergson: yes..there is a similarity...
[13:27] Rentboy Benoir: i bet hearing improves a little too
[13:27] Rentboy Benoir: then you a certain whether its a threat
[13:27] Rentboy Benoir: and then you run for your life
[13:27] Rentboy Benoir: if it is
[13:27] Rentboy Benoir: idk
[13:27] herman Bergson: and you pray that your are fast enough ^_^
[13:27] Rentboy Benoir: lol
[13:27] Rentboy Benoir: hmmm
[13:28] Rentboy Benoir: interesting stuff
[13:28] Mick Nerido: Peditors are more curious than vegetarian animals
[13:28] Rentboy Benoir: i think maybe
[13:28] Rentboy Benoir: the expression the child has is a result of that
[13:28] herman Bergson: I don't know...
[13:28] Rentboy Benoir: obviously its not fear
[13:28] Rentboy Benoir: but it is new
[13:28] herman Bergson: but I once saw a documentary about taming a wild horse,,,
[13:29] Athena John: Is there a gender difference in this part of the brain: surprise/fear?
[13:29] Rentboy Benoir: and i think that new = bad in the cave man era
[13:29] herman Bergson: took only 5 hours , because the animal was curious...
[13:29] Rentboy Benoir: unlikely
[13:29] Rentboy Benoir: emotions are not gender determined
[13:29] Rentboy Benoir: i think
[13:29] herman Bergson: the person played with the curiosity of the wild horse....
[13:29] Athena John: But their bain LOCATION vary by gender
[13:30] herman Bergson: Well Rentboy...
[13:30] Athena John: *brain
[13:30] herman Bergson: research has shown that women and children are more sensible to disgust than men
[13:30] Rentboy Benoir: hmmm
[13:30] Rentboy Benoir: yes
[13:31] Rentboy Benoir: but i still think these are conditioned responses
[13:31] Athena John: We're more sensible ;)
[13:31] Rentboy Benoir: learned
[13:31] Rentboy Benoir: and women are meant to be more disgusted by things than men
[13:31] Rentboy Benoir: its cultural
[13:31] Rentboy Benoir: yet
[13:31] herman Bergson: yes...that is quite well possible....
[13:31] Rentboy Benoir: certain cultures , you'll find hardier women than men
[13:31] herman Bergson: there is a lot of cultural influence with respect to disgust....
[13:31] Athena John: How isthis cultural?
[13:32] Athena John: and why can't I type? lol
[13:32] Rentboy Benoir: amazons
[13:32] Rentboy Benoir: they were tough cookies
[13:32] Rentboy Benoir: a myth maybe
[13:32] Rentboy Benoir: im not sure
[13:32] Rentboy Benoir: lol
[13:32] herman Bergson: Well Xenia was ^_^
[13:32] Athena John: Fighting women exist. :)
[13:32] Mick Nerido: Women bodybuilders
[13:33] Rentboy Benoir: how is it cultural? well, in the west women are conditioned to be more senstive to disgusting things than men
[13:33] Rentboy Benoir: from birth
[13:33] Athena John: Soviet women fought hard in World War 2
[13:33] herman Bergson: As you see...surprise as a basic emotion isnt that complicated....
[13:33] Rentboy Benoir: its what make you all sensitive and all of that good stuff
[13:33] Rentboy Benoir: yeah
[13:33] Rentboy Benoir: russian women are tough
[13:34] Mick Nerido: Comedy is always a surpise like when you laugh at a joke
[13:34] Athena John: As are Japanese, who even now fight for survival
[13:34] herman Bergson: I dont think that the toughness of women is related to either surprise of disgust...
[13:34] Rentboy Benoir: no
[13:34] herman Bergson: although some men find tough women disgusting...especially the bodybuilder types
[13:35] Athena John: Or the warrior types
[13:35] Doodus Moose: (threatening?)
[13:35] herman Bergson: But there you see the influence of culture
[13:35] Clerisse Beeswing: some men do love a girlly girl
[13:35] herman Bergson: Yes Clerisse :-)
[13:35] herman Bergson: More than tough types
[13:36] Rentboy Benoir: what i meant was that i think that , lets say during war time, what may have seemed disgsting becomes a necessity(spell check) like maybe eating rotten produce, which in turn would prolly make them less disgusted with eating something off
[13:36] Rentboy Benoir: in the future
[13:36] herman Bergson: But I don't think that is a matter of disgust, but just personal preferences
[13:36] Athena John: Good point
[13:36] Mick Nerido: digust in taste can save you from eating poison food
[13:36] Clerisse Beeswing: real life I am in between girlly girl and tough..so they must get over it
[13:37] Rentboy Benoir: they get used to it
[13:37] Clerisse Beeswing: when it comes to food..you ever watch andrew zimmerman the guy who easts almost everything
[13:37] Rentboy Benoir: im no longer disgusted by a lot of things
[13:37] Rentboy Benoir: age also plays a role
[13:37] Mick Nerido: I love that show
[13:37] herman Bergson: oh my.....that must be a disgusting sight Clerisse
[13:38] Clerisse Beeswing: he easts bugs and everything
[13:38] Mick Nerido: An acured taste
[13:38] Rentboy Benoir: oh i could eat that
[13:38] Mick Nerido: aquired
[13:38] Clerisse Beeswing: or is he just curious
[13:38] herman Bergson: I'll discuss the basics of disgust in the next lecture....maybe Mr. Zimmerman offers a good example
[13:38] Rentboy Benoir: not for fun though
[13:38] Doodus Moose: MIck - check the local bazaar in China
[13:38] herman Bergson: Eating bugs is just a cultural issue....
[13:39] Rentboy Benoir: i was once in a meat market in kashmir, that was pretty grosss
[13:39] herman Bergson: so it is easy to learn to eat bugs
[13:39] Rentboy Benoir: yes
[13:39] Doodus Moose: precisely
[13:39] Rentboy Benoir: yes
[13:39] Ciska Riverstone: honey ants taste pretty good.
[13:39] herman Bergson: wel....easy.....for some people
[13:39] herman Bergson: For instance Ciska, yes....
[13:39] Clerisse Beeswing: out of survival...well I might have to eat something I would never consider
[13:40] herman Bergson: I have seen that once.....these ants are big bubbles of honey
[13:40] Athena John: Yes in i many cultures, like mine, a delicacy
[13:40] Mick Nerido: Any meat is disgusting to a vegetarian
[13:40] herman Bergson: Well the examples exist Clerisse....canibalism for instance
[13:41] Clerisse Beeswing: well I hope I never have to eat a human in order to survive..not just yet
[13:41] Rentboy Benoir: you see that wouldn't bother me
[13:41] Rentboy Benoir: if they're dead
[13:41] Mick Nerido: Soilent green
[13:41] Rentboy Benoir: its just meat
[13:41] herman Bergson: Not my favorite food either Clerisse ^_^
[13:41] Clerisse Beeswing: lol what a old movie
[13:41] herman Bergson: Yes Mick...good movie!
[13:42] Mick Nerido: Not good eating lol
[13:42] Rentboy Benoir: apparently human fingers are the tastiest bits
[13:42] Rentboy Benoir: if you ever find yourself in that situation take dibs on the fingers
[13:42] Mick Nerido: People are supposed to taste like pork
[13:42] herman Bergson: You think so Rentboy?
[13:42] Clerisse Beeswing: now don't tell me how you cook them..that would disgust me
[13:42] Athena John: there is not much meat on the fingers
[13:43] herman Bergson: Well Mick some humans behave like pigs indeed..so well possible indeed
[13:43] Rentboy Benoir: because they are used the most, also its what a group of cannibals said when they were asked by an anthrop.
[13:44] Mick Nerido: Remember Michael Rockafeller?
[13:44] Doodus Moose: oh
[13:44] herman Bergson: Well....I would suggest to look forward to the next lecture and a disgusting discussion afterwards...^_^
[13:44] Rentboy Benoir: ok
[13:44] Rentboy Benoir: lol
[13:44] Mick Nerido: Thanks
[13:44] Ciska Riverstone: *smiles* - thank you Professor :)
[13:45] herman Bergson: So thank you all for your surprising contribution to this discussion...:-)
[13:45] Rentboy Benoir: id like to see if im still disgusted by anything
[13:45] herman Bergson: Oh you will be rentboy....easily even...
[13:45] Rentboy Benoir: thank you Herman
[13:45] Clerisse Beeswing: thank you professor..interesting enough
[13:45] Athena John: I'm sure you are. It just must be found
[13:45] Rentboy Benoir: ive seen a lot of things
[13:45] herman Bergson: Not so difficult Athena ^_^
[13:45] Rentboy Benoir: im pretty desensitized
13:46] BALDUR Joubert: i need a old jenever now to digest all your stuff
[13:46] herman Bergson: Cool...
[13:46] Rentboy Benoir: not a good thing btw
[13:46] herman Bergson: Thank you all...
[13:46] herman Bergson: Class dismissed ...
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: ♥ Thank You!! ♥
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: ...DANKE :)))
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: .•:*¨☆¨*:• DANKESCHÖN .•:*¨☆¨*:•
[13:47] Qwark Allen: ¸¸.☆´ ¯¨☆.¸¸`☆** **☆´ ¸¸.☆¨¯`☆ H E R MA N ☆´ ¯¨☆.¸¸`☆** **☆´ ¸¸.☆¨¯`
[13:47] Qwark Allen: just got in time
[13:47] herman Bergson: Yes indeed Qwark :-)
[13:47] Qwark Allen: was interesting as allways
[13:47] Qwark Allen: .-)))
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: ______ ()*"*()___
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: _____("(~¸¸~)")___
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: Müde bin ich,geh zur Ruh,
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: mache meine Augen zu.
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: Erst das Rechte,dann das Linke,
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: Gute Nacht und winke winke
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: •´¨*•.¸.♥ Bye Bye ♥.¸.•*¨`•
[13:47] Ciska Riverstone: Nacht Anja - träum gut
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: Tschüss machs gut bis zum nächsten Mal
[13:47] Anja Tigerfish: bye
[13:48] herman Bergson: Nacht Anja ^_^
[13:48] Qwark Allen: see you thursday
[13:48] Anja Tigerfish: Namarie
[13:48] Ciska Riverstone: bye qwark
[13:48] Anja Tigerfish: Have all safe paths and fair winds and honey sweet dreams
[13:48] Doodus Moose: Bless you all, as i am blessed by you all
[13:48] Ciska Riverstone: enjoy your evening doodus
[13:48] herman Bergson: bless you Doodus
[13:49] Ciska Riverstone: bye herman :)
[13:49] herman Bergson: Bye
[13:50] herman Bergson: Well..been a long time no see Athena ^_^
[13:51] Athena John: Yes, I haven't had time to come in world.
[13:51] herman Bergson: I understand..

312: The Brain, Joy and Happiness

Evolution created emotions as means to improve the chances on survival and procreation. Here we focus on the evolutionary development of emotions.

As the philosophical and scientific literature shows, we can discuss forever about the classification of emotions

Daniel Goleman, psychologist and writer of the book on the social IQ once had a talk with the Dalai Lama and learnt that buddhism recognized tenthousands of destructive emotions.

I think we better stick to a more simple classification as formulated by Paul Ekman(1934 -…), psychologist.

Against the view of many anthropologists, including Margaret Mead, Ekman found that facial expressions of emotion are not culturally specific, but identical for different cultures.

This fact advocated the idea that facial expressions, as Darwin once asserted, are biologically determined.

A generally accepted classification is: basic emotions and complex emotion.The complex emotions are more culturally driven and therefor evolutionary more recent.

An emotion like envy, for instance, you can't have on your own. There must be someone else to be envious of, while fear and joy can be individually experienced.

We'll follow the classification of Ekman and regard fear, joy, grief, anger, marvel and disgust as basic emotions. They come with the facial expressions, which showed to be universal.

At New Year we often wish each other a good health for the coming year, but is that our ultimate goal of happiness?

When you think it over, it becomes clear that we mainly want to be healthy because then we are closer to happiness and to knowing joy in life.

So, joy and happiness are more likely our ultimate goals than health. In the "Declaration of Independence " of the USA it is stated literally that we are endowed "with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

This is an interesting statement, for to see the pursuit of happiness as a human right, implies at least that it makes sense to pursue happiness.

Does it also promise us, that when we pursue happiness, we also will achieve it? Do we believe that today?

If so, where does this idea come from, because a lot of people still believe that real happiness will only be found in the afterlife.

It was during the Enlightenment in the 17th and 18th century, that the Idea emerged that a human being can achieve happiness in THIS earthly life.

Happiness now was called the normal condition of man, not a gift of God or a twist of fate, but something that man is entitled to by nature, something, which could be achieved by everyone.

Joy and happiness can be regarded as the most positive emotions and yet there is little scientific literature about them.

One reason is of course, that the concept of happiness is pretty vague and no one has as yet found a satisfactory definition for joy and happiness.

Let's not wind up in an endless debate about the definition of happiness and joy for the moment, but listen to a philosopher of the enlightenment, John Locke (1632 -1704).

Some of you may think, ok…. joy is indeed an emotion, but happiness is more a state of being. True, joy is more a part of happiness.

According to Locke happiness consisted of a combination of joys. But what combination of how many joys? At least Locke is right, that experiencing joy, increases the chance to feel happy.

Next lecture we'll go into detail and explain how evolution wired our brain with the possibility to experience joy and happiness and what it means evolutionary, that happiness is our goal in life.


The Discussion

[13:22] herman Bergson: Thank you...and be happy ^_^
[13:22] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:22] Bejiita Imako: YAY! (yay!)
[13:22] Doodus Moose: a baby smiles when you give it attention - is that joy or programming?
[13:23] herman Bergson: THAT is a real special thing doodus...
[13:23] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): heard that question before...
[13:23] herman Bergson: It shows that joy is innate...
[13:23] BALDUR Joubert: facial expression.... inborn
[13:23] herman Bergson: indeed Baldur...
[13:23] Doodus Moose: perhaps a part of innocence?
[13:23] herman Bergson: I dont see the connection Doodus
[13:24] BALDUR Joubert: lol joy -happinesss and now innocense?
[13:24] Mick Nerido: Is laughter Joy or happiness?
[13:24] herman Bergson: innocence is a pretty religious concept
[13:24] BALDUR Joubert: we will get lost in words...
[13:24] herman Bergson: Laughter is joy Mick
[13:24] Doodus Moose: innocence as opposed to the complexities we learn
[13:24] Doodus Moose: sarcasm, pity, etc
[13:24] Bejiita Imako: YAY! (yay!)
[13:24] Bejiita Imako: now i feel a sudden joy
[13:25] herman Bergson: I think you should keep in mind the disticntion between basic and complex emotions
[13:25] Bejiita Imako: cause LHC have broken a NEW WORLD RECORD
[13:25] BALDUR Joubert: a child ripping of the legs of a spider..sarcasm or innocense?
[13:25] Bejiita Imako: highest power ever now
[13:25] Bejiita Imako: hehe
[13:25] herman Bergson: what you are refering to Doodus are complex emotions...social feelings
[13:25] Mick Nerido: People laugh differently so do they experience joy differently?
[13:26] Blackrose Baroque: [13:24] BALDUR Joubert: a child ripping of the legs of a spider..sarcasm or innocnese? how can you find any joy or hapiness in this?
[13:26] BALDUR Joubert: a child could...
[13:26] herman Bergson: It is even more complex Mick....some people shed tears while they are infact absolutely happy
[13:26] Mick Nerido: tears of joy
[13:27] Bejiita Imako: ah yes that can also be a reaction
[13:27] Doodus Moose: that was my father as he experienced music - his only demonstrated emotion
[13:27] Blackrose Baroque: yes my mommy always cries when she is so happy
[13:27] Bejiita Imako: i've experienced that too
[13:27] Mick Nerido: Me also
[13:27] herman Bergson: Interesting point Doodus..I'll get to that in the next lecture
[13:27] Bejiita Imako: you laugh and cry at same time
[13:27] Bejiita Imako: really overwhelming feeling
[13:28] Mick Nerido: Laughter is involentary but we laugh at differn things at different timmes in our lives does joy evolve?
[13:29] herman Bergson: You can write a book about laughter..
[13:29] herman Bergson: Aristotle did...
[13:30] herman Bergson: and in The name of the Rose by Umberto Ecco it ended up in the destruction of a monestery by fire...^_^
[13:30] Bejiita Imako: I laugh a lot cause feels really nice
[13:30] Bejiita Imako: and when i feel really good i can let it go until i rol on the floor laughing
[13:30] BALDUR Joubert: aristoteles did' ? didn't it but in the name of the rose:)?
[13:30] Bejiita Imako: really nice feeling
[13:30] Mick Nerido: Not copies left?
[13:31] Bejiita Imako: happens kind of often when i'm here in sl
[13:31] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:31] BALDUR Joubert: sena connery couldn't save it......lol
[13:31] herman Bergson: No he couldnt Baldur :-((
[13:31] BALDUR Joubert: laughter lost for us.......
[13:32] herman Bergson: By the way..watched La guerre du feu last night Baldur...
[13:32] herman Bergson: but that among us
[13:32] herman Bergson: ok...
[13:32] BALDUR Joubert: smile ok we'll talk that over one day:)
[13:32] herman Bergson: what it is all about ia how joy and happiness are wired in the brain by evolution...
[13:33] Doodus Moose: perhaps building on reward and avoidance (hippocampus)?
[13:33] herman Bergson: next lecture I'll give you the evolutionary picture...
[13:33] BALDUR Joubert: help....
[13:34] Bejiita Imako: oki
[13:34] herman Bergson: Is there a doctor in the room...Baldur is calling for help!!!
[13:34] BALDUR Joubert: please make a clear distinction between evolution and development of brain
[13:34] Mick Nerido: Why did it say presuit of rather than the attainment of happiness?
[13:34] herman Bergson: oh yes Baldur...
[13:34] BALDUR Joubert: one genetics the other physical...
[13:34] Doodus Moose: a pursuit does not guarantee attainment
[13:35] herman Bergson: No Doodus...
[13:35] herman Bergson: that is the mystery of happiness…
[13:35] Mick Nerido: it could have been written the right to happiness
[13:35] herman Bergson: are you happy.....??? they alway yell...and the public answers YYYEEEAAAAHHHH
[13:36] BALDUR Joubert: happiness is in the pursuit say some wise men:)
[13:36] Doodus Moose: :-)
[13:36] herman Bergson: I read a book about the history of happiness...the idea of happiness to be exact...
[13:36] herman Bergson: and after reading the book I wasn't happy at all..kind of disappointed actually ^_^
[13:37] Mick Nerido: No happy ending
[13:37] herman Bergson: 450 pages for no happiness :-)
[13:37] BALDUR Joubert: gone with the wind lol
[13:37] herman Bergson: no happy ending indeed Mick :-)
[13:37] Bejiita Imako: hehe
[13:38] Mick Nerido: I bet the author was happy when he finished the book
[13:38] Bejiita Imako: that sound not good, if its about happiness it should make u happy at least
[13:38] Blackrose Baroque: lol Mick
[13:38] herman Bergson: lol I guess he was...
[13:38] Bejiita Imako: haha
[13:38] Anja Tigerfish: Hihihi
[13:39] herman Bergson: Well..let's wait till next lecture...maybe afterwards you might feel a little happier then
[13:39] herman Bergson: So..thank you all for your participation...
[13:39] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:39] BALDUR Joubert: just one more question..
[13:39] herman Bergson: See you next Thursday in our search for happiness...:-)
[13:40] herman Bergson: Sure Baldur go ahead
[13:40] Bejiita Imako: sounds nice Herman ㋡
[13:40] BALDUR Joubert: you talked about cutural and ..wait....
[13:40] herman Bergson: I wait...:-)
[13:41] BALDUR Joubert: sorry, lol i ave to scroll back..
[13:41] herman Bergson: we all wait ^_^ ...
[13:41] BALDUR Joubert: basic..lol..
[13:41] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:41] herman Bergson: yes basic and complex emotions...
[13:42] BALDUR Joubert: basic ..what do you mean with basic in contrast to cultural...
[13:42] Blackrose Baroque: dripping icecream on my skirt..
[13:42] herman Bergson: Blackrose..plz!!! Watch out
[13:42] herman Bergson: Well...
[13:42] Blackrose Baroque: sorry sir:)
[13:42] BALDUR Joubert: someone give blackrose a kleenex?
[13:42] herman Bergson: important point Baldur...
[13:42] Bejiita Imako: heheh
[13:43] Bejiita Imako: u should eat it BEFORE it melts then
[13:43] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:43] Blackrose Baroque: ow..yes?
[13:43] Bejiita Imako: but thats tricky and u dont wanna rush something tasty
[13:43] herman Bergson: The basic idea about emotions in an evolutionary sense is that they helped us to survive and procreate..
[13:43] Blackrose Baroque: this is my happiness now..my icecream
[13:43] BALDUR Joubert: ok.. survival codes
[13:43] herman Bergson: yes...
[13:43] Bejiita Imako: which also use to leave my clothes in a mess afterwards, at least if its a warm day
[13:43] Bejiita Imako: heh
[13:44] Doodus Moose: hence the line from the movie "what do i see in him - he makes me laugh".
[13:44] BALDUR Joubert: especially in social groups
[13:44] herman Bergson: emotions were the mechanisms that made social behavior possible...
[13:44] BALDUR Joubert: ok..agree
[13:44] herman Bergson: the basic emotions like fear and joy can be experiences individually...
[13:44] herman Bergson: with them you can survive...
[13:45] BALDUR Joubert: hm...
[13:45] herman Bergson: the complex emotions are culturally determined in the sense that you need the other for that ..
[13:45] BALDUR Joubert: so microbes have fear anr joy?¨
[13:45] herman Bergson: envy is such an emotion..
[13:45] herman Bergson: you only can be envious of someone else...
[13:46] BALDUR Joubert: i mean simple organisms live much longer than complex ones...
[13:46] herman Bergson: sexual jealousy is such an emotion...
[13:46] herman Bergson: that is not true Baldur...so far so good...we are still here!
[13:46] BALDUR Joubert: you said individulal experience.. that would mean independent of a social environment
[13:47] herman Bergson: and I claim that we are the most complex ones on this planet ^_^
[13:47] Blackrose Baroque: i think it's important to laugh..it makes a bond between people..
[13:47] Blackrose Baroque: when you smile...at some one..you get a smile back
[13:47] herman Bergson: yes...I can experience fear myself...is not related to others
[13:47] Mick Nerido: People joke a lot when they are afraid
[13:48] herman Bergson: we will get to that in the next lecture Blackrose!
[13:48] Bejiita Imako: yes and when someone laygh u start laughing as well
[13:48] BALDUR Joubert: exist longer smile sorry.. i hat to be imprecise:)
[13:48] Bejiita Imako: just the sound make u do that
[13:48] BALDUR Joubert: smile but i think we have to get deeper into lets laugh theories lol
[13:48] BALDUR Joubert: in class..
[13:48] Doodus Moose: what proceses causes another to sneeze once someone else sneezes?
[13:48] Doodus Moose: (just wondering)
[13:48] BALDUR Joubert: hayfever dood?
[13:49] Doodus Moose: or yawning
[13:49] Bejiita Imako: hmm that i have never experienced howeever
[13:49] Blackrose Baroque: nome either
[13:49] Bejiita Imako: yawning however
[13:49] herman Bergson: it is a common phenomenon Doodus...mimicry it is called I think...
[13:49] BALDUR Joubert: oh you sneeze when you yawn' '
[13:49] Mick Nerido: I have to walk my dogs bye...
[13:49] Blackrose Baroque: bye Mick
[13:49] BALDUR Joubert: some fart ..grin.. sorry but true..lol
[13:50] Bejiita Imako: when everyone around you seem to be bored and tired u get also the same way, cause thats the general feeling in the place sort of
[13:50] herman Bergson: copying the gestures of other to show social connection
[13:50] BALDUR Joubert: mirror neurons.. smile they pop up all the time:)
[13:50] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): i was logged out
[13:50] herman Bergson: Are you ok Gemma???
[13:50] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): ☆*¨¨*:• I'm Back! What'd I Miss?? •:*¨¨*☆
[13:50] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): Hey!
[13:50] Bejiita Imako: wb Gemma
[13:50] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ Thank Youuuuuuuuuu!! ♥
[13:50] BALDUR Joubert: fun -joy and happiness gemma:)
[13:51] Blackrose Baroque: you missed a lot of joy Gemma
[13:51] Anja Tigerfish: -WB
[13:51] Bejiita Imako: YAY! (yay!)
[13:51] herman Bergson: ok..I think next lecture will be fun then....:-)
[13:52] Bejiita Imako: aaa yes
[13:52] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:52] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): i wil have to read the blog of this one
[13:52] Doodus Moose: time to eat over here - thanks everyone!!
[13:52] herman Bergson: Thank you all....
[13:52] Bejiita Imako: cu Doodus ㋡
[13:52] herman Bergson: Class dismissed ^_^
[13:52] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ Thank Youuuuuuuuuu!! ♥
[13:52] Gemma Allen (gemma.cleanslate): Bye, Bye ㋡
[13:52] Ciska Riverstone: Thank You herman - thanx everyone - enjoy :-)
[13:52] Bejiita Imako: oki
[13:52] Bejiita Imako: cu next time then ㋡
[13:52] Bejiita Imako: and some of u in a while
[13:52] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:53] Bejiita Imako: nice as usual this
[13:53] Bejiita Imako: ㋡
[13:53] Blackrose Baroque: thank you sir for the lecture
[13:53] herman Bergson: My pleasure Blackrose
[13:53] Blackrose Baroque: bye bye