Tuesday, January 21, 2020

821: The "Just-Wait-And-See" Doomsday Thinker...

The second type of pessimist recognizes, in contrast to the nostalgic pessimist, that the world has improved considerably in the last two centuries. 
Only, he proclaims, that this beautiful song cannot last. That is the doom thinker of the 'wait and see' school. 
We will soon be crossing some critical threshold, after which we will dive straight into the abyss. 
'Wait and see' - doom thinkers come in different forms, which appear to be far apart, but in reality have much in common. 
The two most important doom images of our time are those of the imminent climate catastrophe and the 'take-over crowding' due to Islamization. 
From a sociological point of view these doom images look like each other's photo negative. The stronger people believe in one apocalypse, the less likely they are to take the other seriously, and vice versa. 
Take the publicist Wim van Rooy, (1947) a Belgian germanist, writer en philosopher and a critic of Islam, the multicultural society, the European Union and postmodernism.
He paints a jetty picture of the future in his bulky books in which Europe is being overrun by Muslim hordes. 
Is Van Rooy an inveterate pessimist, always expecting the worst? No way. He seems completely immune to doom images about the climate. 
He labels climate activists as 'green Taliban' and 'hysterical believers'. It seems that the only climate that Van Rooy is aware of is 
the "politically correct climate" that is helping European civilization to its collapse. 
The ecological doom thinkers for their part seem largely insensitive to fears about Islamization and mass migration. 
The danger of 'Wait and see' doom thinking is that it can spur on remedies that are worse than the disease. 
The conviction that the world is going to the limit unless we take drastic action provides sensible people with a rational justification 
for taking inhumane measures that otherwise would never occur to them, like separating children from their parents.
Doom thinkers, who warned of the impending population explosion from the 1960s onwards, 
argued for forced sterilization and for what field nurses on the battlefield call 'triage': saving whoever can be saved, leaving others to die.
They wanted to apply the same logic to food distribution. Only send food to the countries that seemingly still can be saved. 
You can see "wait and see" doom thinking as the mirror image of utopian thinking, and it is harmful for the same reason. 
On the horizon, not the perfect world beckons, but the scorching catastrophe. Both doom thinking and utopian thinking are a kind of casino games where the stake is infinitely high.

Or as Philipp Blom, (1970) is a historian, novelist, journalist and translator writes ominously at the end of his jetty book about the climate catastrophe: What is at stake? Everything. "
Everything? That is a dangerous way of thinking as if the future is just a gamble.
A final damaging effect of doom thinking, opposite to that, is that it can paralyze us. 
Climate activists such as George Monbiot and Bruno Latour nowadays bluntly state that the war is over and we have lost. 
If that is really true, then we should of course better quickly enjoy as much as we can till the end is there. 
Even with doom prophets of Islamization sometimes you find such resignation - the islam will take over West -Europe, the end of white supremacy.
A variation on this is, that it is over with Western culture, The doom thinker might believe that it can't be stopped and the Chinese will take over.
Just wait and see......!!!
Thank you for your attention again....
The Discussion
[13:17] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): thank you Herman
[13:17] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:18] herman Bergson: Was this to your liking CB? :-)
[13:19] CB Axel: I'm more pessimistic about the environment than in the end of white supremacy.
[13:19] CB Axel: I'm also more afraid of Christian fundamentalists who are trying to bring on the end-times.
[13:19] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): agree, as long as it don't mean IS terrorists blowing us all up with bombs
[13:19] herman Bergson: Well that's one half of the story :-)
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but the clmate change we can clearly see
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako) whispers: as I said before its blooming!
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and its january only
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): way too early
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): never seen this before I think
[13:20] Lente (lentelies.anatine) is offline.
[13:20] herman Bergson: In your case CB, you only can mean AMerican fundamentalists.....
[13:21] Ciska Riverstone is offline.
[13:21] herman Bergson: That is a weird species in the Christian world
[13:21] CB Axel: I hope it's only American.
[13:21] herman Bergson: I think it is
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): when u end every political and military statement with IN GOD WE TRUST u have a problem
[13:22] CB Axel: Is thinking that mankind will destroy itself optimistic or pessimistic?
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): religion and important decissions don't mix
[13:22] herman Bergson: or with GOD BLESS YOU....also one of those AMerican statements
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): GOD told us to drop bombs on them God told us that
[13:23] herman Bergson: But we are talking about the doomsday believer here as the perfect pessimist
[13:24] herman Bergson: Not the favorite type here, it seems :-)
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): the most recent example would be now with Trump and Iran (but we made it I think)
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): I believe many of these pessimists were on the edge, Wait ad see soon the nukes will fall all over the entire planet
[13:24] herman Bergson: yes Bejiita...next doomsday is the re-election of Trump :-)
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): luckily this seems not to be the case
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): for now
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but just wait and see!
[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): agree Herman
[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): he can't continue, he plays god with dangerous dudes all over the word
[13:25] CB Axel: But, Bejiita, that's the best case scenario for the end-of-time people. They want us all to "meet our maker" and be judged.
[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm I guess
[13:26] CB Axel: That's why I want to see Pence removed along with Trump.
[13:26] CB Axel: But now Putin is trying to become the next czar.
[13:26] herman Bergson: Pence is a doomsday thinker, I guess
[13:26] CB Axel: I'm not sure who'd craziest in that bunch.
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): what im afraid is that he will make someone of these angry and start WW3 or something similar, things like that assassination before have started world wars before
[13:27] CB Axel: I believe he is, Herman.
[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but hopefully we know better now
[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): to not start another one
[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): after see how horribly the 2 previous went
[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): so HOPEfULLY we have learned from this
[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): all of us
[13:28] CB Axel: America came out of WW2 in good shape. There are people who think war is a good thing for the economy.
[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): (sighs) sadly yes
[13:28] herman Bergson: Oh it was....
[13:28] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and indeed tech innovation like the microwave came from a war radar invention + accidental discovery
[13:29] herman Bergson: General Motors produced for Nazi Germany in those days...
[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): question is hasn't the magnetron and microwave been invented if not for WW2?
[13:29] CB Axel: Businesses will sell to anyone who will pay them. They have no morals.
[13:29] herman Bergson: That fits our doomsday thinking...:-)
[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): or had it been discovered for other reasons, after all radar is very usable in general for navigation
[13:30] herman Bergson: We do not speculate here Bejiita :-)
[13:30] CB Axel: Bejiita, I prefer space exploration as a means of furthering our tech innovation. :)
[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): me too CB
[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): much better
[13:31] herman Bergson: Jet engine and rocket were invented in the arms industry...
[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): this and what organizations like CERN does, they also push tech like crazy without dropping bombs
[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yes herman
[[13:31] herman Bergson: and now we can fly wherever we want :-)
[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): polluting the air until the climate change kills us all
[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako) whispers: just wait and se!
[13:31] CB Axel: Which furthers pollution and warms the planet
[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe
[13:32] CB Axel: LOL Bejiita.
[13:32] herman Bergson: True CB....so here we have doomsday again :-)
[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm
[13:33] herman Bergson: I read some article....about the inclination of man to always believe in some apocalyps...
[13:33] herman Bergson: the belief that it can't last forever
[13:34] herman Bergson: which is what Just wait and see thinkers claim
[13:34] herman Bergson: But you know...it is the perspective.....
[13:35] herman Bergson: The Dinos said to eachother...can't last forever and were extinct but the earth is still there :-)
[13:35] herman Bergson: So, the doomsday belief is rather selective...
[13:35] CB Axel: Yes. People always talk about the end of the world, but the Earth will always be here. It just may not have humans.
[13:36] herman Bergson: Right CB:-)
[13:36] CB Axel: I think an Earth without homo sapiens might be a good thing.
[13:36] CB Axel: Is that optimism?
[13:36] herman Bergson: And I think the earth wouldn't she d a tears because of that :-)
[13:37] herman Bergson: I think it wouldn't make a difference.....
[13:37] CB Axel: I guess maybe optimism depends on one's point of view. From the animals' perspective it could be a good thing.
[13:37] herman Bergson: The earth is just the earth as it is at any given moment....
[13:37] herman Bergson: and that's it :-)
[13:39] herman Bergson: Well...I think the "Just-wait-and-see" thinker is not our piec eof cake
[13:39] CB Axel: No. That's not me. We still don't know what kind of pessimist I am.
[13:39] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but its one well known type of pessimist for sure
[13:39] herman Bergson: It is indeed Bejiita
[13:40] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): lol. Bejiita:)
[13:40] CB Axel: LOL
[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): that is like those classics who bang on metal sheets WORLDS END IS HERE DONG DONG DONG!
[13:40] herman Bergson: I appreciate your optimism Bejiita ^_^
[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): lol
[13:41] CB Axel: :)
[13:41] herman Bergson: So...I would say to you all Just wait and see and thus conclude our discussion :-))
[13:41] CB Axel: These seem to be the funniest pessimists so far.
[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): just wait and see, soon it will all sort out hopefully
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): cu around
[13:42] herman Bergson: Yes, CB, I like such ideas too :-)
[13:42] CB Axel: Yes. I'll wait and see what we talk about next week.
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): till next time
[13:42] herman Bergson: Class dismissed and enjoy your weekend :-)
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): same
[13:42] CB Axel: Goodbye until Tuesday.
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:42] bergfrau Apfelbaum: Thank you Herman and class!

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