Wednesday, February 7, 2018

697: Create your own Self.....

Both Rousseau and Marx state that an authentic life is a life in which we are guided by our true needs. 
In order to lead an authentic life, we have to coincide with our 'real' self, or the self that is determined by these true needs. 
According to the French philosopher Jean-Paul Sartre (I905-1980), however, this is the world upside down. 
To be able to live authentically it is not necessary to first know who we are by nature. 
There is absolutely no 'real' self that can be 'discovered' in one way or another and with which we can or can not coincide. 
It is exactly the other way around: an authentic person is a person who makes choices in all sincerity 
without being guided by a so-called human nature that dictates how he should act. 
Sartre illustrates this with the following example.
 A young man must choose between fighting for his homeland during the war or assisting his sick mother. 
This is a devilish dilemma, because the young man would, of course, prefer to take care of his mother and to prevent her from dying lonely, 
but he also knows he has to fight for his country to prevent the enemy from winning. 
According to Sartre, in this case it is not that one of these two choices is more authentic than the other. 
It is not so much which choice is made. It is the way in which the choice is made and justified that determines whether the choice is genuine or not. 
Sartre states that the choice of the young man is not sincere when he shifts his responsibility for choice to something or someone else, 
for example by asking a friend what he should do, or throwing a dice to determine his choice. 
If he then says that he acted like that because his friend said so, or because fate has so determined, the young man acts "in bad faith".
He denies that he is fundamentally free and therefore himself bears full responsibility for his choice.
This sounds of course very promising: creating your authentic Self by radical and independent choices.
However, this is academic philosophy. This would only function when we were a kind of abstractions from reality.
We are, however, organisms living in a real world and this real world influences our choices.
Besides that, we are not empty vessels at the  moments, that we have to make choices. We HAVE information, which we have to take into account.
We also have values, which stronger than a friend's advise can influence our choice and decision.
So.,  the idea of absolute freedom of Sartre is to academic and abstract? As such yes, but consider this:
When you have to make a choice, you do that within the context of a real world, that is, within the context of your information and values.
It is very well possible that two persons in the same situation thence come to different choices.
Thus, maybe, personal authenticity is not defined by the choices you make, but by the ways, the motivations you have to come to your decisions.
Thank you for your attention... ^_^

Main Sources:
MacMillan The Encyclopedia of Philosophy, 2nd edition
Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy, 1995
John Searle: The Mystery of Consciousness (1997)
Antonio Damasio: Self comes to Mind (2010) Bruin/F. Jongepier/ Maargt: IK, Filosofie van het Zelf (2017)

The Discussion
[13:20] Ciska Riverstone: thanx herman
[13:20] herman Bergson: Take your time to think this over.....:-)
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm
[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I think the with all sincerity is a clue
[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but still
[13:22] herman Bergson: Bsic idea is, that in the freedom of action we have, it is our style of dealing with things which shows our authenticity as a person.....
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): one man with all sincerity may say  my mother deserves my attention
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): teh one man .. i love my mother but
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): the country mUST survive
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): survive
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): not easy as usual
[13:23] CB Axel: Why must the country survive?
[13:23] CB Axel: What has it ever done for me? hehehe
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): in the end its all up to you and you are always responsible for your action
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): as i get it
[13:23] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): because his mother might become a slave
[13:23] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): or die
[13:23] herman Bergson: Becaue otherwise his mother will be killed, CB
[13:23] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): anyway
[13:23] CB Axel: But then, my mother never did much for me, either.
[13:23] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): he can take care for his mother..and he can do that all by himself..taking care for the country takes more people
[13:23] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): he can't do that alone
[13:23] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): waht lousy choices
[13:24] herman Bergson: But of he stays with his mother they might call him selfish
[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): buthe is sincere
[13:24] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): selfish?
[13:24] herman Bergson: heartless towards his fellow countrymen
[13:24] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): by taking care for his mother?
[13:24] CB Axel: If he goes to war, his mother might call him selfish. °͜°
[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): again it all depends on sincerity
[13:25] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes CB
[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm indeed a tricky situation
[13:25] herman Bergson: Maybe it all depends on information and values....
[13:26] herman Bergson: BAsic value  = human life e.g.
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): in the worst case he might be accused for being a traitor if not doing the war
[13:26] herman Bergson: enemy is close or far away.....
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): thats how sad the case can be
[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes
[13:26] bergfrau Apfelbaum: a good child looks after the sick mother and sends the neighbors to war .. smile
[13:27] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): :)
[13:27] CB Axel: °͜°
[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): what a mess
[13:27] herman Bergson: that  is a smart child...Bergie :-))
[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): sartre was always a pain
[13:27] CB Axel: Does he have siblings who can care for the mother? I'm guessing not. On the other hand, there are plenty of young men a country can sacrifice to war.
[13:27] CB Axel: LOL, Gemma.
[13:28] herman Bergson: What is clear  here is that we are not absolutely free in our choices at all...
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): very true
[13:28] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): he can say, i will take care for my mother and what ohters think of me , I don't care
[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i guess
[13:29] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): you can't please everyone
[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): we are pushed so to say by different things and situations
[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): especially us!!!!!!!!!
[13:29] CB Axel: He can also leave his mother and his country behind and live his own life as he pleases somewhere else.
[13:29] Jeroen (roto.diesel) is online.
[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that would be a different authentic self
[13:30] Mariella (mariella.deezul) is online.
[13:30] herman Bergson: If there are no moral values, CB,  he could, I guess :-)
[13:30] CB Axel: The Ayn Rand self.
[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes omg
[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): OMG!!!
[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): OUCH
[13:30] herman Bergson: YEs...dont stick with the loosers...
[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that person
[13:31] CB Axel: Don't forget, I'm living in what I call a "I got mine" society.
[13:32] herman Bergson: If the persoon took his values and information into account , it would help him to choose
[13:32] herman Bergson: But this is not the absolute freedom of choice Sartre had in mind
[13:32] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok
[13:33] Ciska Riverstone: what did he have in mind?
[13:33] herman Bergson: To be honest...what he HAD in mind, I cant tell you  regarding freedom (of choice)
[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): told you he was a pain
[13:34] CB Axel: It's a secret? Or you don't know?
[13:34] CB Axel: lol
[13:34] herman Bergson: I agree Gemma :-)
[13:34] Ciska Riverstone: heheheh Gemma
[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): nothing ness
[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): all or nothing
[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe
[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): I guess
[13:34] herman Bergson: But what I said at the end of my lecture.....
[13:35] herman Bergson: what makes you authentic is HOW you come to your choice, your decision...
[13:35] Ciska Riverstone: meaning intentions based on values?
[13:35] herman Bergson: You make an evaluation of the situation and then decide
[13:35] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ah
[13:36] herman Bergson: Yes Ciska
[13:36] Ciska Riverstone: yes 8fold path in buddhism.
[13:36] CB Axel: Not the decision itself but the process?
[13:36] Ciska Riverstone: things keep repeating  - I wonder if Sartre knew that one
[13:36] herman Bergson: Wel..guess I jus invented the wheel again ? :-)
[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe
[13:37] Ciska Riverstone: how u get there yes CB - u get to the decision because of....
[13:37] herman Bergson: Yes CB
[13:37] Ciska Riverstone: psychologically spoken - shrinks usually work on intentions with people
[13:38] Ciska Riverstone: and then on values
[13:38] herman Bergson: That makes a statement like....AS a child you already......... :-)
[13:38] herman Bergson: understandable
[13:38] Ciska Riverstone: (which should help people to become more conscious and make better decisions for themselves in their situation)
[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): hopefully
[13:39] herman Bergson: Cognitive Emotional Therapy
[13:39] Ciska Riverstone: would be one yes
[13:40] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i am sure there is a group in sl that deals with that
[13:40] Ciska Riverstone: yes
[13:40] herman Bergson: Which could mean that our authenticity...our self the process in deal with the world
[13:41] herman Bergson: Something to think about....:-)
[13:41] herman Bergson: Oh...and before I forget....
[13:41] herman Bergson: You'll get a week off....
[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): always leave with something to think about
[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ahha
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok
[13:42] herman Bergson: No class next week, for then I am on the Island again :-))
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): another vacation??
[13:42] Ciska Riverstone: happy vacation
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): wonderful
[13:42] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): Schier here he comes:)
[13:42] bergfrau Apfelbaum: ahh yeah:-) wonderful
[13:42] herman Bergson: of course Gemma....
[13:42] CB Axel: You go on as many vacations at Trump. LOL
[13:42] Ciska Riverstone: don't swim too much ;)
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaa i was just gonna ask are you going to Shier again?
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): making up for all the intense weeks we had in teh early days
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:42] CB Axel: You deserve it. He doesn't. °͜°
[13:42] herman Bergson: lol...indeed CB....
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): much less vacation
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): haha indeed
[13:43] CB Axel: I need a dose of nature, too. I think I'll drive down to the river and go for a walk after class. °͜°
[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): nice
[13:43] herman Bergson: So....let me dismiss this class and wish you a nice week with extra spare time :-)
[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): anyone like mardi gras parades?????
[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): have a good time there now Herman
[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i have lm for  a really nice one
[13:43] CB Axel: Have a great time, Herman!
[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): thank you Herman
[13:44] herman Bergson: Franny's? Gemma?
[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): fijne vakantie
[13:44] CB Axel: Mardi Gras isn't for a couple of weeks, isn't it?
[13:44] herman Bergson: thank you all :-)
[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): never rememr when it is
[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): just that it is a sign of spring
[13:44] Ciska Riverstone: thank you
[13:44] herman Bergson: nor do I Bejiita ^_^
[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): I thought you would be in Maastricht due Carnaval:)
[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): have only done it in here
[13:44] herman Bergson: oh my!
[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): just like burning man
[13:45] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): grins
[13:45] CB Axel: Laissez les BON TEMPS rouler!

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