Thursday, March 14, 2019

765: Creating the Welfare State......

What is the purpose of a state? John Locke (1632 - 1704) argued that human beings are originally equal and independent. 
Originally, in the state of nature, the law of reason teaches mankind that human beings have the unassailable rights of life, liberty, and property.
However, in the state of nature there are not only people who want to obey the law of reason but also others who offend against this law. 
These people endanger peace and safety in society. 
According to Locke, only the state could offer a just remedy against this harmful side of the state of nature. 
The precondition of this remedy, however, is that the state must uphold certain restrictions which make it more preferable for human beings 
to live within the state than in the state of nature. This means that the state should regulate through laws the unassailable rights of human beings.
The common good of the citizens is the purpose of the state, which was for centuries defined by taking care of internal en national security and trade in all its forms.
The upper class had money enough to obtain healthcare and education, while the lower class mainly was dependent on charity for such matters.
This slowly begins to change during the Industrial Revolution. In the 1880s, Bismarck had made provisions in Germany for insurance against misfortune, illness, old age and disability.
In the 20th century the social consciousness of the state increases. Employment, education, healthcare and elderly care, for instance, became matters of state.
During World War Two there was a great interest in the social aspects of the state. In the previous lecture we learnt about the 'christian social principles', articulated by William Temple.
In 1941 a gouvernement official, Sir William Beveridge, got the assignment to make an inventory of all social insurances in the UK.
He interpreted his assignment somewhat wider and November 30, 1942 long queues formed at the door of the State Printing.
In one day all 60.000 available copies of "Social Insurance and Allied Services" were sold. Eventually 600.000 copies were produced.
Some were dropped in occupied Nazi-Europe. Two copies ended up in Hitler's bunker in Berlin where they were found with comments and marked 'secret' at the end of the war. 
In one of the comments, the plans are considered "a consistent system. .. of remarkable simplicity, on almost all points better than the current German social insurance".
In his report, Beveridge wrote two things. National health care, child benefits and unemployment benefits had to be provided 
and the benefits had to be equal for everyone, high enough to live on and paid for by employees, employers and the state. 
Beveridge was strongly opposed to research into individual incomes or a sliding scale of benefits because he understood 
that they would cause more problems than they would solve, especially because of the bureaucracy that would be required for complex systems. 
He knew all the arguments that too high benefits would lead to people not seeking work, 
but he was also sympathetic to research, which had shown that low wages in large families were the main cause of poverty.
You may wonder, why all these social issues were put on the agenda of politics in those days. Maybe the explanation is fear for communism, 
fear for what had happened in the Soviet Union. Maybe this also explains to some extend, why neo-liberalism goes full throttle these days 
and the Welfare State which emerged after World War II is on its return and economic growth is the rising star.
Thank you for your attention again.....

The Discussion

[13:15] herman Bergson: The floor is yours...:-)
[13:16] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:16] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ Thank Youuuuuuuuuu!! ♥
[13:16] Alarice Beaumont: I think it's difficult to find the right balance between those things.. taxes and health care... I mean.. it is a good thing that in Europe we have that kind of system
[13:16] herman Bergson: I am really inclined to believe that all this social compassion of the politicians partly is caused by their fear of Stalin and his communism
[13:16] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes Alarice
[13:16] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): some don't like too much regulation
[13:17] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i consider most a protection
[13:17] herman Bergson: Why this fear of regulation?
[13:17] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I agree with that herman
[13:17] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): call it intrusion
[13:17] Alarice Beaumont: look at the states.. no good .. rich should share their money ... but at the moment I think it's getting difficult in Europe to maintain that system
[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): here there is such a pull back of good regulation is scary
[13:18] CB Axel: Most, if not all. regulations were enacted because someone was harmed by the unregulated.
[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): on air
[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): water
[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): The rich avoid taxes and place all their money in foreign tax paradises like Cayman Islands
[13:18] herman Bergson: The fall of communist regimes opens the doors for full power liberalism
[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): allowing more drilling for heaven sake
[13:18] herman Bergson: The rich get richer and the poor poorer
[13:18] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): :-)
[13:19] herman Bergson: that is the current tendency
[13:19] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): what is really sad is when owners of private schools, and hospitals gamble with other peoples life and future to gain money to these tax paradices
[13:19] herman Bergson: Pickety showed us
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): they don't care about providing education or healthcare unless you are rich and then your money will end up in one of these bastards ta paradise in the end
[13:20] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): not fair
[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): goodness bej
[13:21] herman Bergson: Yes I am really amazed about the huge amount of money that is shifted around in the financial world
[13:21] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yes and just piled up
[13:21] herman Bergson: yes BEJIITA
[13:21] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its just for boasting
[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes and that is also true of trying very hard to privatize education
[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): is a battle
[13:22] Alarice Beaumont: yes.. which is not good... education should stay public I think... an Pickety really has a point!
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): "HEY LOOK AT HOW MUCH MONEY I HAVE IM BETTER THEN EVERYONE ELSE!"
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): like that
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes all
[13:22] herman Bergson: Education is a national collective responsibility imo
[13:22] CB Axel: I agree, Herman.
[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): very true
[13:22] herman Bergson: like healthcare
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): and that was what was intended
[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): originally
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): it should NOT be used as cash cows!
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but they are
[13:23] herman Bergson: the whole country benefits of healthy well educated citizens
[13:23] CB Axel: People say they want tax money to go to private schools because the public schools are not very good. I think tax money should go to fixing the public schools.
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): agree cb
[13:23] herman Bergson: sounds more logical to me indeed CB
[13:23] CB Axel: Instead our tax money goes to wars we don't need and bailing out businesses that should be allowed to fail.
[13:24] herman Bergson: Why are those public schools not good?
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and that tax money is amiss because the rich are hiding them in these tax paradises
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): among other things
[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): absolutely cb
[13:24] KumoMano: agreeing and wondering what will be the final outcome be.
[13:24] CB Axel: Herman, it's because the public schools are financed by the people in their own districts.
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): thus giving their private schools a boost so they can make and hide away even more
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its an evil circle
[13:24] CB Axel: If you live in a poor district, the schools get underfunded.
[13:25] herman Bergson: Poor system.....not working...
[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): true, its not
[13:25] CB Axel: It's another case of the poor getting poorer and the rich getting richer.
[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): logically
[13:25] herman Bergson: and keeping the poor poor, because they either get no proper education or have to leave their district
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): the sad and unfair reality
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): :(
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): it have to stop
[13:26] Alarice Beaumont: and their would be enough money - the heritage could go to the public
[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that is always a big fight
[13:27] Alarice Beaumont: and it's so difficult to find the right system!
[13:27] herman Bergson: Depends on the mentality of the people in a state....
[13:28] herman Bergson: after the war there was closeness and brotherhood.....the efforts to people loved to share....
[13:28] Alarice Beaumont: yes.. but it's not easy to change the mentality!
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): and I'm Sorry! to say in this day and age much of the privatizing is to keep the wrong people out
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I sorry..
[13:28] herman Bergson: today we have become very individualistic....
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): the wrong color
[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that is what really started the issue
[13:28] Alarice Beaumont: yes.. Herman.. but that is not so bad ..
[13:29] herman Bergson: if we stay able to share with each other, no
[13:29] Alarice Beaumont: yes.. true
[13:29] herman Bergson: But when you already start with yelling America First, and here in Europe trying to keep all refugees out....
[13:30] herman Bergson: That is not contributing to a social attitude
[13:30] Alarice Beaumont: well. the Germans didn't yell.. but honestly.. what do we do? It's always Germany first, too!
[13:30] herman Bergson: And the Netherlands tries to be second all the time :-))
[13:31] Alarice Beaumont: lol
[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:31] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): well tho your prime minister has been so good on the issue
[13:31] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): Netherlands could lead the world in preparation for the climate changes
[13:31] herman Bergson: He is indeed Gemma... he is a smart guy :-)
[13:31] herman Bergson: It seems that we try to :-)
[13:32] CB Axel: Being second isn't all that bad. You can get a lot of the benefits of being near the top without all the responsibility. :-)
[13:32] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yep
[13:32] Alarice Beaumont: :)
[13:32] herman Bergson: Smart move CB :-)
[13:32] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): well the bottom feeders cb
[13:32] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): they are they ones who must try harder
[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): and we seem to be becoming one
[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): scary
[13:33] Alarice Beaumont: the problem is how does one make the people to see that money isn't all and that sharing is good?!
[13:33] herman Bergson: What we can see at least is that we are losing the social democratic heritage of the 20th century more or less
[13:33] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed :(
[13:33] Alarice Beaumont: very right :(
[13:33] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): goes down the drain
[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): true
[13:34] Alarice Beaumont: a real shame
[13:34] herman Bergson: The emphasis on money, Alarice, that is indeed the point
[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i still always say we need a good alien invasion
[13:34] CB Axel: LOL
[13:34] Alarice Beaumont: omg no Gemma :))
[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that will remind us we ae alll human!!!!!!!
[13:34] herman Bergson: Everything is motivated here by....YES this is GOOD for the economy
[13:34] CB Axel: And war does bring people together even if it is too kill other people.
[13:35] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): is true
[13:35] CB Axel: Unfortunately, Herman, what is good for the economy is bad for a lot of the people.
[13:35] herman Bergson: and this slogan ....we have learnt to read the implications....if good for the economy it is good for you, it is good for all people
[13:35] CB Axel: Not when low wages is good for the economy.
[13:35] herman Bergson: Yes CB, but that they don't dare to say
[13:36] Alarice Beaumont: but is this statement really true?
[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but it is true indeed
[13:36] herman Bergson: Wages havent gone up in more than ten years here.....
[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): at least mostly, cause it promotes greed
[13:36] herman Bergson: profits have grown and grown however
[13:36] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): middle class same her
[13:36] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): here
[13:36] CB Axel: We can't count on an alien invasion. What we need is a good, old-fashion plague.
[13:36] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): same issue
[13:37] Alarice Beaumont: oh no... there must be another way!
[13:37] CB Axel: Kill off 2/3 of the workers, and then the rich will appreciate the ones who are left more.
[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): (looks for anthrax bottle in bag)
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): well then they may charge 15000 for a cure here cb
[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehehe
[13:37] KumoMano: the rise of the robot work force
[13:37] herman Bergson: kill off all the rich and we are all rich :-)
[13:37] Alarice Beaumont: lol
[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): lol
[13:37] CB Axel: We don't want a cure. We want to kill off the poor. It's worked in the past.
[13:38] Alarice Beaumont: I always wonder what is the reason it's changing to the "bad" side...
[13:38] Alarice Beaumont: who initiates it?
[13:38] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): its all a mess
[13:38] herman Bergson: The big money, Alarice
[13:38] herman Bergson: Reagan and Thatcher gave the banks in the 80s all freedom
[13:38] Alarice Beaumont: I think it was better in th 70 / 80 ties... what went wrong later?
[13:39] herman Bergson: The deregulation of the banks, to begin with
[13:39] CB Axel: Every time we deregulate the banks they begin doing the same stupid things that led to the great depression.
[13:39] CB Axel: They don't learn.
[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): here the banks were put on good rule when the market crashed and now they are starting to remove regulations here too
[13:39] herman Bergson: The dirty mortgages which only were created to make a profit fotr the banks
[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yep
[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): of course
[13:40] herman Bergson: The belief that a company is not only a profit machine but also has a social responsibility has vanished
[13:40] KumoMano: Yes
[13:40] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): seems so
[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): true
[13:40] CB Axel nods
[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): as said, its just abut making MORE MORE MOOOORE! money!
[13:41] herman Bergson: creating employment is not only for making has also a social meaning for the lives of workers
[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): nothing else
[13:41] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): out of control everything
[13:41] KumoMano: And corporations now cross borders in their influence of societies
[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): well we are going down the bad side of things again
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): keep the good in mind
[13:42] herman Bergson: Yes Kumo, that is one of the worst phenomena
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): bet the crash 2008 have not learned them anything either when basically the entire world collapsed (only in my city 20 or more companies closed forever)
[13:42] Alarice Beaumont: yes Herman.. how does one get this thinking about responsibility back?! that is what I am wondering about.. there should be a way
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): so wi will probably be there soon again
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): sigh
[13:42] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): what saved my company is we are a niche buisness (making golf course stuff)
[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we need that lecture of about a month ago again
[13:43] herman Bergson: You are right Gemma.....we shouldn't be that negative :-)
[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): the one listing the good for humanity
[13:43] CB Axel: Michael Moore made a good documentary called "Where to Invade Next" where he compares business practices in other countries to the US.
[13:43] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): he is clever
[13:43] CB Axel: I always like what Moore has to say even though I don't always agree with how he says it. But I really liked that one.
[13:44] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): is it on you tube?
[13:44] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): or where
[13:45] CB Axel: I'm not sure where I saw it. I may have borrowed the DVD from the library.
[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ah
[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): wel li will look for it
[13:45] CB Axel: BTW, the library system is one socialist system that works. :-)
[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): very true
[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): hope that does not go private
[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): agree
[13:46] Alarice Beaumont: yes.. hopefully not Gemma ...
[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): must not
[13:46] herman Bergson: More is an Youtube, can be watched for 2.29 euro :-)
[13:46] herman Bergson:
[13:46] Alarice Beaumont: oh didn't know one can buy youtube videos
[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): not here anyway
[13:47] herman Bergson: Is new to me too Alarice
[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but is shows unavailable to me
[13:47] herman Bergson: Never seen it before
[13:47] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): video not avaible
[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right
[13:47] Alarice Beaumont: ah.. with me it just says "not available" :(
[13:47] CB Axel: Amazon has it, too, for something like US$2.99 OR 3.99.
[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): must be a private way to join
[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ah ok
[13:47] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): or need premium maybee to acss
[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i can get it ..
[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i have prime
[13:48] herman Bergson: a 2 hour documentary
[13:48] CB Axel: YouTube has it for US$3.99, Gemma.
[13:48] herman Bergson: Well....I guess we have saved the world again today
[13:48] CB Axel: LOL
[13:48] Alarice Beaumont: ah no.. not really lol
[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): at least we tried
[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:48] Alarice Beaumont: yes
[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and we will try more again next time
[13:49] herman Bergson: so I think it is time to relax again and wonder where to invade next :-)
[13:49] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): agree
[13:49] herman Bergson: Thank you all again for your participation :-))
[13:49] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): im gonna invade some rich bastards safe good old fashioned way with some dynamite
[13:49] herman Bergson: Class dismissed.....
[13:49] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): olsen brothers style
[13:49] Alarice Beaumont: lol
[13:49] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ha stil hae to rent i see
[13:49] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): or Jönssonligan as the swedish version is called
[13:50] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): 3.99
[13:50] CB Axel: i did want to point out that Bejiita is learning the wrong English! Last week he used the term BS correctly and translated it for someone else. LOL
[13:50] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!
[13:50] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...
[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): is that so?
[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:50] CB Axel: I'm just teasing you, Bejiita.
[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaa yes
[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i know
[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:50] KumoMano: seems I can't learn where to attack next either..shame..not allowed in my country:)
[13:50] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and thats no BS!
[13:51] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):
[13:51] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hehe
[13:51] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): oki cu next time
[13:51] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I have to run off

[13:51] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ Thank Youuuuuuuuuu!! ♥

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