Thursday, February 25, 2021

905: Who Invented Capitalism....???

 Who invented capitalism?


In the previous lecture, we saw that communities in the Middle Ages were organized by a feudal system.


Feudalism was a combination of the legal, economic, military, and cultural customs that flourished in Medieval Europe between the 9th and 15th centuries. 


Broadly defined, it was a way of structuring society around relationships that were derived from the holding of land in exchange for service or labor.


In other words, if you work my land supply me with food, I'll supply protection and safety to you.


It was precisely on this point that Europe underwent a decisive change in the sixteenth century. From that time on, the people's market would give way to a market that was truly capitalist. 


With the latter, the merchant puts the maximization of his individual profit first and the community becomes an unrelated category. 


It is clear that this transition did not take place equally quickly everywhere. In several countries around the North Sea, for example, 


thinking in terms of individual interests took hold relatively quickly, while Italian economists continued to emphasize the significance of the common interest well into the eighteenth century.


Several countries around the North Sea...I'll be honest with you. THE country, that "invented" capitalism was the Netherlands.


It was my ancestors, who were thinking in terms of individual interests as the main motivation of trade. And they invented a perfect system for it: shares.


In 1602 shares in the Dutch Vereenigde Oost-Indische Compagnie (VOC, better known as the Dutch East India Company) were issued, 


suddenly creating what is usually considered the world's first publicly-traded company.. 


A publicly-traded company is a company whose ownership is organized via shares of stock (the total of all shares of a company)which are intended to be freely traded on a stock exchange market.

The arrival of VOC shares was momentous because it opened up the ownership of companies and the ideas they generated, 


beyond the ranks of the aristocracy and the very rich, so that everyone could finally participate in the speculative freedom of transactions. 


By expanding ownership of its company pie for a certain price and a tentative return, the Dutch had done something historic: they had created a capital market.


Ultimately, capitalist thinking took over the whole width, a change to which several factors contributed. The emergence of national states after the Peace of Munster (1648), for example, 


which ended the 80 Years War between the Dutch Provinces and Spain giving the Provinces independence.


It led to the distinction between a public and a private sphere. While the public interest became a matter for states or absolutist monarchs, merchants were primarily concerned with their private interests.


 As a result, European entrepreneurs increasingly focused on maximizing their corporate profits while leaving public affairs to others. 


This is evidence of a way of thinking that differs essentially from the medieval pursuit of community.


The tables had turned. In the Middle Ages, the order was community first, then private interest. From now on, however, it was private interest first 


and the interests of the community,? We'll leave them to the state. And capitalism was a fact....


Thank you for your attention again....


MacMillan The Encyclopedia of Philosophy, 2nd edition
Routledge Encyclopedia of Philosophy, 1995
Gabriel van den Brink:"Ruw Ontwaken uit een Neoliberale Droom",, 2020


The Discussion

[13:18] Thank you for your attention again....

[13:18] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): Thank you Herman

[13:19] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): We are not going to condemn capitalism are we?

[13:19] herman Bergson: it was us...the Dutchies who dropped community interests for private interests....

[13:19] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): well did they really drop it??

[13:19] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): or change it

[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): still not really sure that the feudal ism was much more that a nthr form of slavery

[13:20] herman Bergson: If you look ate the huge gap between the poor and the rich since the 16th century.....what is your conclusion?

[13:20] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): there was definitely same gap for different reasons before

[13:20] CB Axel: There has always been a huge gap between the poor and the rich.

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i agree

[13:21] herman Bergson: Yes Gemma, I guess that is true....but it also was a life of reciprocity

[13:21] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): it is just a different form of gap

[13:21] CB Axel: The nobility was rich. Their serfs were poor.

[13:21] herman Bergson: It wasn't a welfare state indeed

[13:21] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and the farmers were the poorest and stood lowest in the feudal chain

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): thinks there is a loss of balance between the rich and poor

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that grows still today

[13:22] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i think there were 4 classes

[13:22] CB Axel: I think capitalism just made a middle class.

[13:22] CB Axel: Or a bigger middle class.

[13:22] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): also thinks more money education would help

[13:22] herman Bergson: What I am thinking of is....

[13:23] CB Axel: 4 classes, Bejiita?

[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):

[13:23] CB Axel: Rich, poor, middle

[13:23] herman Bergson: when private interests became dominant and a majority had to suffer poverrty...that gave rise to revolutions

[13:23] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that is true

[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): dont know how to say it in english. In Swedish its from top to bottom, Adel, präster(priests), borgare, bönder(peasants)

[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): oh the monks as a class

[13:24] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ok

[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aa

[13:24] herman Bergson: That was the medieval structure Bejiita

[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): thats what i learned in school anyway

[13:25] CB Axel: I wondered if the clergy had their own class. :)

[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): think so

[13:25] CB Axel: w00t w00t

[13:25] herman Bergson: until the urbanisation took place and you got the that the right word?

[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): most retained the community

[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yes

[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): guil

[13:25] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): guild yes

[13:25] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaaa

[13:25] FrannyDJ Dean is offline.

[13:26] herman Bergson: That was the upcoming middleclass

[13:26] CB Axel: So you don't think there were revolutions before there was capitalism? Or is it the other way around?

[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): hmmm

[13:26] herman Bergson: hmmmm...interesting question Gemma

[13:26] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that was cb

[13:27] herman Bergson: As far as my knowledge of history goes.....I think a revolution of the lower classes against the upper class was 1789 as a first one

[13:27] herman Bergson: in France

[13:27] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but out of some of the revolution good came

[13:27] CB Axel: I'm thinking about 1215 when King John (?) was made to sign the Magna Carta.

[13:28] CB Axel: I think it was John.

[13:28] herman Bergson: Interesting CB...

[13:28] herman Bergson: We also had Cromwell....

[13:28] herman Bergson: don't know the details about him

[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): he was a doozy

[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:28] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:29] herman Bergson: a what?

[13:29] CB Axel: A doozy.

[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): is just a term for some kind of guy

[13:29] CB Axel: I'll look up a definition.

[13:29] herman Bergson: what is a doozy? :-)

[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I'm Sorry! i used it

[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I sorry..

[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): sounds like a tired bastard

[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): lol

[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): doozing off

[13:29] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): he caused a lot of trouble

[13:30] herman Bergson: Oh he did...

[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): many heads rolled

[13:30] FrannyDJ Dean is online.

[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok

[13:30] CB Axel: An extraordinary one of its kind

[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right!!

[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): like trump is a doozy

[13:30] herman Bergson: but as a revolution I regard a conflict between social classes.....not between political paries

[13:30] CB Axel: That's what Merriam-Webster says it is.

[13:30] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ah k

[13:31] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): guess that is why i used it

[13:31] CB Axel: The Magna Carta was a conflict between the king and the nobility.

[13:31] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): first term that came to mind

[13:31] herman Bergson: But ...reluctant to say it...but the Dutch invented capitalism

[13:31] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): it sounds familiar

[13:31] herman Bergson: making money with money

[13:31] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we wont blame you

[13:32] CB Axel: There is nothing wrong with capitalism. Just unfettered capitalism.

[13:32] CB Axel: It needs to be regulated.

[13:32] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): i agree cb

[13:32] herman Bergson: I agree CB

[13:33] herman Bergson: It is only that it has gone out of control in our days

[13:33] CB Axel: If you let businesses do anything they want in the interest of profit you end up with an entire power grid failing. :)

[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): right

[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): and covid did not help!!

[13:33] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): noded

[13:33] herman Bergson: Ahh Gemma COVID helped.....

[13:33] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): indeed it can be made to work but indeed out of control now

[13:33] CB Axel: I blame the libertarians. They're against government regulation.

[13:33] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): well not the poor

[13:33] herman Bergson: It revealed that you can not use a system of market forces in the healthcare system.....

[13:34] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm true Gemma

[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ha

[13:34] CB Axel: Very true

[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): think they will admit that here ?

[13:34] herman Bergson: they begin to realize this here in the shows to be one big failure

[13:34] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but true

[13:34] CB Axel: More and more Americans are beginning to see it that way, Gemma.

[13:34] CB Axel: Hence the popularity of Obama Care.

[13:35] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): but not those that will do anything about it soon

[13:35] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): sigh

[13:35] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): it is a mess of a so called health system

[13:35] CB Axel: They will if people vote for those who will do something.

[13:35] herman Bergson: it is a kind of balance....

[13:35] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): not a system just a mess

[13:35] herman Bergson: between private interest and  community interests...

[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): sadly even more peope opposed obama care and voted Trump in

[13:36] herman Bergson: and these days private interests still dominate the debate

[13:36] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): yep and with their money

[13:36] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yep

[13:36] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): and some even go from government to work in the industry

[13:37] CB Axel: Even some people who voted for Trump like Obama Care (as long as you don't call it that).

[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): true

[13:37] herman Bergson: Americans are funny people :-)

[13:37] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok

[13:37] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I thnk Biden has he idea of improving it

[13:38] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hmm confusing

[13:38] CB Axel: With Trump it was the other way around. He brought in people from private business to try to run the government. DeVoss, for example.

[13:38] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): it  is

[13:38] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): oye

[13:38] herman Bergson: If you want to hear the latest news....

[13:38] CB Axel: Well, Herman, a lot of people vote on single issues.

[13:38] herman Bergson: America lost its international leadership under Trump

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): that is  a huge problem yes

[13:39] herman Bergson: Biden tries to restore it....

[13:39] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaa i hope he can mess everything out and untie it, at moment it looks a bit like my tangle of 3D filament at my production station

[13:39] herman Bergson: but the reaction in Europe is...

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): he will

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): I bet you

[13:39] CB Axel: If they think Democrats will take their guns, they'll vote for a Republican no matter how incompetent they are.

[13:39] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and just like that quite hopeless to untie (this particular piece did not came on a spool)

[13:39] herman Bergson: You may...but what after your four no way

[13:39] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): depends

[13:40] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok

[13:40] CB Axel: If a politician says they're not anti-abortion, some people would not vote for them if they promised anything else.

[13:40] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): true

[13:41] herman Bergson: We have a number of one-issue parties here

[13:41] herman Bergson: So silly

[13:41] herman Bergson: a party for 50+ elderly

[13:41] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ha

[13:41] herman Bergson: a party against islamization

[13:42] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): a party for animals

[13:42] CB Axel: I'm not sure taking some of the responsibility for leadership away from the US is a bad thing.

[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ll

[13:42] herman Bergson: a party against immigants

[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): animals?

[13:42] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): yes

[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:42] herman Bergson: Ahh yes...A Party for Animals

[13:42] herman Bergson: the rights of animals

[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we stuff all the issues into our two

[13:42] CB Axel: Party animals? LOL

[13:42] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): all the chickens can vote:))

[13:42] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): love it

[13:42] herman Bergson: Yes we have CB :-)

[13:42] CB Axel: LOL, Beertje.

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): where the rich  show off all their tigers snakes and crocodiles?

[13:43] herman Bergson: lol Beertje

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i prefer party animals yes

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): lol

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): like me

[13:43] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):

[13:43] herman Bergson: There are more chickens and pigs in the Netherlands than human inhabitants

[13:43] herman Bergson: we'll be out voted

[13:43] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): but it's really true..we have party for animals

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): but what animals

[13:44] herman Bergson: for animal rights....

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): sounds interesting though

[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): all animals

[13:44] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): we have private groups or that

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): (thuinks about happy mini goats jumping about)

[13:44] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): who lobby congrss

[13:44] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): thinks

[13:44] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): otherwise it would be discrimination

[13:45] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): it guess we have over 40 parties here

[13:45] herman Bergson: you know where capitalism came from.....greedy Dutch merchants :-))

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:45] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): hahaha

[13:45] CB Axel: Oh, don't let the pigs vote or we'll end up like Animal Farm.

[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): lol

[13:45] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): well

[13:45] bergfrau Apfelbaum: lol

[13:45] herman Bergson: All animals are equal, but pigs are more  equal :-)

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): actually the animals might do a better vote then us

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): i bet they are not greedy

[13:46] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): lol yes Herman

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): true

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): and a happy goat party would be awesome

[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): love those creatures, makes me happy

[13:46] CB Axel: There are more pigs than people in Iowa.

[13:46] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) screams like a goat!! :

[13:47] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): lol

[13:47] herman Bergson: Well I guess I can close this animal form for today :-))

[13:47] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ok

[13:47] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako):

[13:47] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): I think I ruined your class with the party for animals:))

[13:47] herman Bergson: Unless you still have that important remark or observation....

[13:48] herman Bergson: Thank you all again....

[13:48] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ♥ Thank Youuuuuuuuuu!! ♥

[13:48] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): nice again Herman

[13:48] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): hope i make it tomorrow and thursday

[13:48] herman Bergson: Class dismissed....and take your animals with you :-)

[13:48] bergfrau Apfelbaum: thank you Herman and class:-)

[13:48] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate) GIGGLES!!

[13:48] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): ...LOL...

[13:48] Gemma (gemma.cleanslate): bye

[13:48] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): :))

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