In the context of a series of non-academic lectures about "The History of Economic Thought", the following text is meant to be a first introduction to economics and human behavior in relation to the beginning of capitalism. Evaluate and rate the text:
In the previous lecture, I defined socialism as a social and economic doctrine that calls for public rather than private ownership or control of property and natural resources.
According to the socialist view, individuals do not live or work in isolation but live in cooperation with one another.
Furthermore, everything that people produce is in some sense a social product, and everyone who contributes to the production of a good is entitled to a share in it.
Society as a whole, therefore, should own or at least control property for the benefit of all its members.
The core question is here: how to deal with private property? With that in mind, we all know that this socialist approach is not so popular in capitalist societies.
In capitalist countries, opposition to these ideas ranges from fierce hostility to cautious acceptance.
One reason is of this opposition is, of course, the perceived failures of many 20th-century socialist states, but that doesn't answer our question: why this opposition from capitalist systems?
For an answer, I'd like to remind you of the fact that economic thought for centuries has been a part of moral and theological thought and not an independent science.
Modern economic theories come with complex mathematical theories and calculations. It almost looks like physics with its math and laws of nature.
There is, however, a fundamental difference: physics deals with standalone matter, and economics deals with human behavior. The behavior of matter is predictable; human behavior is only to some extent.
And to make it even more complex, matter behaves according to the laws of physics and can't change its mind qua behavior. Human beings can, which makes them now and then unpredictable in their behavior.
What I try to say is that although current economic thought is a well-established science, it isn't about the use and flow of money and so on, but it is actually about human behavior.
It is about how we live and work together, how we own things, and how we share things. In other words, it is, in essence, human interaction in relation to money and the ownership of the material world.
And it is precisely this human interaction, specifically, our changing views on ownership, self-interest, and cooperation, that holds the key to understanding why capitalism, not socialism, became the dominant system in the West.
This is why economic thought is probably as old as mankind, and if we want an answer to the question: Why is capitalism today the dominant economic system?
We must turn to history and study what man has thought about how a society should deal with money and private property.
Main Sources:
MacMillan The Encyclopedia of Philosophy, 2nd edition
of Economic Thought (2012)
TABLE OF CONTENT -----------------------------------------------------------------
1 - 100 Philosophers 9 May 2009 Start of
2 - 25+ Women Philosophers 10 May 2009 this blog
3 - 25 Adventures in Thinking 10 May 2009
4 - Modern Theories of Ethics 29 Oct 2009
5 - The Ideal State 24 Febr 2010 / 234
6 - The Mystery of the Brain 3 Sept 2010 / 266
7 - The Utopia of the Free Market 16 Febr 2012 / 383
8. - The Aftermath of Neo-liberalism 5 Sept 2012 / 413
9. - The Art Not to Be an Egoist 6 Nov 2012 / 426
10 - Non-Western Philosophy 29 May 2013 / 477
11 - Why Science is Right 2 Sept 2014 / 534
12 - A Philosopher looks at Atheism 1 Jan 2015 / 557
13 - EVIL, a philosophical investigation 17 Apr 2015 / 580
14 - Existentialism and Free Will 2 Sept 2015 / 586
15 - Spinoza 2 Sept 2016 / 615
16 - The Meaning of Life 13 Febr 2017 / 637
17 - In Search of my Self 6 Sept 2017 / 670
18 - The 20th Century Revisited 3 Apr 2018 / 706
19 - The Pessimist 11 Jan 2020 / 819
20 - The Optimist 9 Febr 2020 / 824
21 - Awakening from a Neoliberal Dream 8 Oct 2020 / 872
22 - A World Full of Patterns 1 Apr 2021 / 912
23 - The Concept of Freedom 8 Jan 2022 / 965
24 - Materialism 7 Sept 2022 / 1011
25 - Historical Materialism 5 Oct 2023 / 1088
26 - The Bonobo and the Atheist 9 Jan 2024 / 1102
27 - Artificial Intelligence 9 Feb 2024 / 1108
28 - Why Am I Here 6 Sept 2024 / 1139
The Discussion
[13:10] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): thank you Herman
[13:11] Max Chatnoir: The connection of money to social power?
[13:11] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aha
[13:11] Stranger Nightfire whispers: I am often amazed by the wide popularity of the John Lennon song Imagine
[13:11] herman Bergson: Not really, I'd say
[13:12] Stranger Nightfire whispers: imagine no possesions
[13:12] herman Bergson: Rather the connection between money and the unlimited accumulation of wealth
[13:12] herman Bergson: And step two is then the connection with power
[13:13] Max Chatnoir: Bribe a politician,. get laws that benefit you....
[13:13] Max Chatnoir: especially tax laws.
[13:13] herman Bergson: Things like that, Max
[13:13] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): in short, its all about greed
[13:14] herman Bergson: But the first thing is...how could an individual accumulate so much money...?
[13:14] herman Bergson: ssssttt...Bejiita ㋡
[13:14] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): that wealth and a good life in general belong only to a lucky few and ot everyone
[13:14] Max Chatnoir: Why is the wealth gap so much bigger than it was a few decades ago.
[13:15] herman Bergson: Difficult to say, but in coming lectures Ihope to figure that out for you....
[13:15] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok
[13:15] herman Bergson: It is related to a change in attitude towards economics....
[13:15] Max Chatnoir: and corporations
[13:16] Kali Finesmith: I do find it fascinating just how much western civilization is dependent on cheap labors from outside. Even the lower rungs in a capitalist society benefit from it.
[13:16] herman Bergson: As I mentioned some time ago...the Ethics course is at best optional at MBA colleges
[13:16] Stranger Nightfire whispers: During the Eisenhower administration the most wealthy were paying as much as 90 percent in taxes
[13:17] bergfrau Apfelbaum: i think inheritances also play a role. i own nothing.... i inherit something... i invest it (wisely).... and so on
[13:18] herman Bergson: As I said, the attitude has changed, and in relation to cheap labor...it is a main characteristic on current capitalism...exploitation....which was already an issue for Karl Marx
[13:18] herman Bergson: Yes Bergie, old money....
[13:18] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aah
[13:19] Kali Finesmith: I'm not sure that capitalism has ever prospered without exploitation
[13:19] herman Bergson: And that is what we'll see in current economic thought...the justification of exploitation of cheap labor....
[13:20] herman Bergson: but that is for coming lectures...
[13:20] herman Bergson: But again there you see the relation between economics and marality....
[13:20] herman Bergson: morality...
[13:21] herman Bergson: exploiting children in confection industries in India etc...no moral questions asked
[13:22] herman Bergson: A mountain of issues to discuss as you see
[13:22] Stranger Nightfire whispers: i can remember when as conservative a Rrpublican president as Richard Nixon stated that we are all Keynesian=-s now
[13:22] Stranger Nightfire whispers: then along came Regan
[13:23] herman Bergson: Indeed Stranger and then came MAGA
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aha!
[13:23] herman Bergson: And Thacher in the UK
[13:23] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yep, that as well
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): all going downhill
[13:24] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): and the influence of Ayn Rand
[13:24] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): yep
[13:24] herman Bergson: But what we first have to investigate is socialist ideas through the ages...
[13:25] Max Chatnoir: Was MAGA before or after those two SCOTUS decisions? The one about corporations being people, and the one about money being speech?
[13:25] Kali Finesmith: That would be after, if my timeline serves me well.
[13:25] herman Bergson: so that you can see that mankind always has know that there was something questionable about the actual system...for instance the inequality in societies
[13:25] Max Chatnoir: That is my sense of it, too, Kali/
[13:26] herman Bergson: MAGA is of recent times...first we had Reagan and Thacher...they paved the way
[13:26] Stranger Nightfire whispers: the one about corporations being people happend soon after the civil war as i recall
[13:26] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): we can all prosper and develop together I say but these ones among others ruined it all
[13:27] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): taking it in the wrong direction
[13:28] herman Bergson: Ahh yes Stranger...completely new phenomenon....a corporation became a person in juridical sense....
[13:28] herman Bergson: consequently the CEO was nnot directly responsible anymore for what the corporation did...so you had to sue the corporation
[13:28] Stranger Nightfire whispers: The Supreme Court established that campaign expenditures constitute free speech in the landmark case Buckley v. Valeo, 424 U.S. 1 (1976), decided on January 30, 1976
[13:29] Stranger Nightfire whispers: not sure why I am whispering
[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaa yes, at lest here in sweden there is a term "juridisk person" corporates acting as physical persons so the same rules will apply for both
[13:29] Max Chatnoir: Wow, that was a long time ago!
[13:29] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): thats how i get it
[13:29] herman Bergson: Maybe you are sitting on your Shift key Stranger :-)
[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aaa yes this term
[13:30] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juridical_person
[13:30] Stranger Nightfire: but Citizen United took it further in 2010
[13:30] herman Bergson: This is one of those examples of how economic thought changed after 1920 and later
[13:31] Max Chatnoir: How long have we had paid lobbyists?
[13:31] herman Bergson: I don't know
[13:32] herman Bergson: I guess it started when the big corporations began to rule the country...so I guess around the 1950s?
[13:33] herman Bergson: By ruling the ocuntry I mainly mean, started buying politicians
[13:33] Max Chatnoir: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_lobbying_in_the_United_States
[13:33] herman Bergson: OK,, Max!
[13:34] Max Chatnoir: Looks like it was well established even by 1976
[13:35] herman Bergson: Yes and started already at the end of the industrial revolution... 1880, it seems
[13:35] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ok
[13:35] Max Chatnoir: Wow, look at that 1891 cartoon!
[13:35] herman Bergson: Interesting subject...
[13:37] Max Chatnoir: I think congresspeople should be informed about whatever issues they are dealing with, but when does information turn into corruption?
[13:38] herman Bergson: When they vote A if paid and B if not paid by the corporations?
[13:39] Max Chatnoir: So it's legal for lobbyists to do that?
[13:40] Stranger Nightfire: there was a time when wealthy businessmen would jut walk itno a congresman's office carrying a suitcase an then leave without the suitcase
[13:40] herman Bergson: Well... you get a 400 million dollars plane and you give the donor sensitive chips in return...?
[13:40] Stranger Nightfire: suitcase full of cash
[13:40] Stranger Nightfire: these days they tend to be a bit more subtle
[13:41] Max Chatnoir: Too subtle for an average lawyer not to be able to spot what's going on?
[13:42] herman Bergson: We only can speculate about that, Max
[13:43] herman Bergson: But I guess we'd better move on to the next lecture :-)
[13:44] Stranger Nightfire: well in additon to campain contributions you can make huge donations to things like the Clinton foundation
[13:44] herman Bergson: Still a lot of work to do before we in current times...
[13:44] Stranger Nightfire: and Trump as all kinds of clever ways to take bribes
[13:44] herman Bergson: Buy his bitecoins
[13:45] herman Bergson: But before I do that, I thank you all again for the discussion....
[13:45] herman Bergson: See you on Thursday,
[13:45] herman Bergson: Class dismissed...
[13:45] Max Chatnoir: See you all then....
[13:45] .: Beertje :. (beertje.beaumont): Thank you Herman
[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): ㋡
[13:46] Max Chatnoir: Thank you for making me think about economics, Herman.
[13:46] bergfrau Apfelbaum: thank you Herman and class
[13:46] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): aah
[13:47] Particle Physicist Bejiita (bejiita.imako): another really good one
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